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Tech and Homebrew => Turbo/PCE Game/Tool Development => Topic started by: Dicer on February 22, 2017, 03:43:57 AM
Title: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: Dicer on February 22, 2017, 03:43:57 AM
Looks better than what the SEGA CD chruns out, why wasn't this used all the time?
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: Necromancer on February 22, 2017, 04:27:21 AM
Yep. Gulliver Boy (and the Yuna disc) was released in mid '95, making it one of last few games released.
Had it been perfected years earlier when the Super CD came out, I bet it would've been used more often. Even if it never was used for something like Night Trap (no loss), it would've been great for the various games based on existing animated franchises, recycling some animated clips as cut scenes or using the existing staff to make some new stuff.
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: SignOfZeta on February 22, 2017, 09:09:20 AM
Post-PlayStation I don't think there was enough money in PCE budgets to produce the original footage.
Regarding Yuna: I've always wondered what the origin of this clip was. That version of Yuna 1, the reprint that came with the HuVIDEO disc, was released when Yuna 2 came out or very near that time. They didn't throw it in with Yuna 2, that game has zero HuVIDEO or any other type of FMV, IIRC. The footage is all of Yuna and the robo girls from the first game. Yuna's design is from the first game, not Yuna 2. Then when it finishes playing you get some Mika Akitaka art works.
It just seems really unlikely to me that Hudson would bother to spend $10k or whatever on that clip just to throw it in with a reprint. I wonder if it was a pilot film for a failed OVA (eventual OVA uses different designs) or a trade show or something. Maybe a tape that played in a store?
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: Black Tiger on February 22, 2017, 10:28:01 AM
The Yuna footage was probably a promo like the Dawn of Ys anime and they would have become OVAs if there was percieved demand. I think that Hudson was always fishing for a chance to turn one of their games into an anime and then expand it into a major property. They did a Ziria movie early on, but I don't know how successful it was. I was shocked that the updated Tengai Makyou II got the quality cinemas that it did, considering that it was othereise a budget release.
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: Michirin9801 on February 22, 2017, 11:09:35 AM
It really looks amazing! That's one way the PCE's amazing colour count really came in handy ;3 The Sega CD would have needed a 32x to put out something that looked this good-looking...
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: SamIAm on February 22, 2017, 02:20:55 PM
If anyone is curious, I know that both Tengai Makyo III and part two of Monster Maker were supposed to have HuVideo before they got moved or canceled.
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: Arkhan on February 22, 2017, 02:23:00 PM
It's a combination of the technical effort, and the production effort to get it all done.
Kind of a lot of work.
But... the topic did come up for Saber Rider. That would be the ideal way to play real clips back.
That, or porn
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: Black Tiger on February 23, 2017, 02:08:12 AM
Gulliver Boy's cinemas push 100 colors at times, but Power Golf 2's HuVideo looks like it only uses a single palette.
John Madden is also supposed to use HuVideo.
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: BigusSchmuck on February 23, 2017, 02:44:15 PM
Curious, has the homebrewn scene cracked huvideo? It would be interesting to see what else could be used with it and what limitations you could do with it. It would be rather humorous to see like an early Turbo/PCE commercial being played on the platform. It also would be even better to see Guilver Boy get a proper fan translation some day. :)
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: Arkhan on February 23, 2017, 06:45:41 PM
Curious, has the homebrewn scene cracked huvideo? It would be interesting to see what else could be used with it and what limitations you could do with it. It would be rather humorous to see like an early Turbo/PCE commercial being played on the platform. It also would be even better to see Guilver Boy get a proper fan translation some day. :)
Tom had a HuVideo demo with Bubblegum Crisis videos, IIRC.
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: Dicer on February 24, 2017, 03:18:43 AM
I didn't realize it came that late to the game, sad really because performance wise it's terribly impressive, esp compared to other video compression of the time.
Oh well...
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: Sadler on February 24, 2017, 04:07:19 AM
Curious, has the homebrewn scene cracked huvideo? It would be interesting to see what else could be used with it and what limitations you could do with it. It would be rather humorous to see like an early Turbo/PCE commercial being played on the platform. It also would be even better to see Guilver Boy get a proper fan translation some day. :)
Tom had a HuVideo demo with Bubblegum Crisis videos, IIRC.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRNw9ccJHS4
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: Michirin9801 on February 24, 2017, 04:44:51 AM
Curious, has the homebrewn scene cracked huvideo? It would be interesting to see what else could be used with it and what limitations you could do with it. It would be rather humorous to see like an early Turbo/PCE commercial being played on the platform. It also would be even better to see Guilver Boy get a proper fan translation some day. :)
Tom had a HuVideo demo with Bubblegum Crisis videos, IIRC.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRNw9ccJHS4
Oh wow, even with 16 colours it already looks great, but imagine that with 240, or at least 120 colours...
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: elmer on February 24, 2017, 05:01:02 AM
Oh wow, even with 16 colours it already looks great, but imagine that with 240, or at least 120 colours...
Yeah ... it's a toolchain issue. High-quality simultaneous tile-and-palette reduction has always been a Black Art.
IIRC bonknuts has been working on a tool to do that.
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: Joe Redifer on February 24, 2017, 08:58:22 PM
Be thankful. If this had been able to be used early in the CD system's life, then games would be plagued with this nonsense like the Sega CD. Granted in Japan it would all be anime stuffs since that's all they know. I can appreciate animated, non-grainy cutscenes. But for me it's harder to appreciate when it's grainy video... at least when it's anime.
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: shubibiman on February 24, 2017, 10:25:54 PM
Just to answer the original question : because 1995 ? ;)
Title: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: esteban on March 08, 2017, 08:00:21 AM
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: SignOfZeta on March 08, 2017, 08:39:26 AM
The Yuna HuVIDEO clip does not contain "all of the cinema scenes from the first PCE game". Since the first game didn't use HuVIDEO that's impossible by definition. Also, its a two minute clip and Yuna 1 has what must be hours of cinemas.
What it contains is a short promo clip that looks like an anime intro with a lot of posing and shooting, then it auto cues at the first frame of a slide show of images from books, magazines, etc. Nothing on this disc was ever in any game that I'm aware of.
I didn't know about the Yuna 2 disc on this list and he doesn't mention it otherwise. Does anyone know where this came from? This is the first I've heard of it.
Title: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: esteban on March 08, 2017, 09:00:25 AM
The Yuna HuVIDEO clip does not contain "all of the cinema scenes from the first PCE game". Since the first game didn't use HuVIDEO that's impossible by definition. Also, its a two minute clip and Yuna 1 has what must be hours of cinemas.
What it contains is a short promo clip that looks like an anime intro with a lot of posing and shooting, then it auto cues at the first frame of a slide show of images from books, magazines, etc. Nothing on this disc was ever in any game that I'm aware of.
I didn't know about the Yuna 2 disc on this list and he doesn't mention it otherwise. Does anyone know where this came from? This is the first I've heard of it.
Aha!
Thanks for clarifying about the contents of that Yuna disc.
:)
The Yuna 2 disc is from the old thread (s) here at pcefx, IIRC.
I wrote these pages a few years ago, so it must be 2-4 years? (Or something like that).
...if that helps searching the forums.
:)
Personally, I want to find out more about that internal Hudson demo with the Dr. Mario clone!
Oh well...
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: Michirin9801 on March 08, 2017, 02:46:12 PM
The Yuna HuVIDEO clip does not contain "all of the cinema scenes from the first PCE game". Since the first game didn't use HuVIDEO that's impossible by definition. Also, its a two minute clip and Yuna 1 has what must be hours of cinemas.
What it contains is a short promo clip that looks like an anime intro with a lot of posing and shooting, then it auto cues at the first frame of a slide show of images from books, magazines, etc. Nothing on this disc was ever in any game that I'm aware of.
The promos and commercials for the first Yuna game used the same animation cuts that ended up in the Yuna HuVIDEO disc, here I found a couple of examples: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91OSUs4yAlo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XLa_Kj4miLg There used to be another CM on YouTube that also used these animation cuts but I can't seem to find it anymore... Oh well...
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: Necromancer on March 09, 2017, 02:05:21 AM
Nothing on this disc was ever in any game that I'm aware of.
Some (all?) of the art stills were reused for the intermission screens in Yuna 2.
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: xelement5x on March 13, 2017, 10:02:11 AM
So discussion came up elsewhere about the Bad Apple video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkgK8eUdpAo&fmt=22
Which has been covered or converted in some way to run on a lot of different hardware: Mega Drive/Genesis https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vPe452cegU
SNES https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASUsvXTNgIg
And it goes on and on in YouTube, but there is no PC-Engine or Turbo version.
Anyway, any chance someone with superior coding chops (maybe Bonknuts or someone else who understands how) could convert it to HuVideo? A ground up version like the one Steph did for the MegaDrive would be cool, but I get the feeling that a HuVideo version would at least be a neat novelty as well.
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: Dicer on March 13, 2017, 11:40:21 AM
So discussion came up elsewhere about the Bad Apple video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkgK8eUdpAo&fmt=22
Which has been covered or converted in some way to run on a lot of different hardware: Mega Drive/Genesis https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vPe452cegU
SNES https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASUsvXTNgIg
And it goes on and on in YouTube, but there is no PC-Engine or Turbo version.
Anyway, any chance someone with superior coding chops (maybe Bonknuts or someone else who understands how) could convert it to HuVideo? A ground up version like the one Steph did for the MegaDrive would be cool, but I get the feeling that a HuVideo version would at least be a neat novelty as well.
Looking around we might be the only damn system left without a copy of bad apple...
Atari 2600 check Ti calculator check Vectrex Check Apple II, check IMB AT/XT check Master system check Nes check Sansa clip f*cking mp3 player check
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: Black Tiger on March 13, 2017, 12:27:07 PM
So discussion came up elsewhere about the Bad Apple video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkgK8eUdpAo&fmt=22
Which has been covered or converted in some way to run on a lot of different hardware: Mega Drive/Genesis https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vPe452cegU
SNES https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASUsvXTNgIg
And it goes on and on in YouTube, but there is no PC-Engine or Turbo version.
Anyway, any chance someone with superior coding chops (maybe Bonknuts or someone else who understands how) could convert it to HuVideo? A ground up version like the one Steph did for the MegaDrive would be cool, but I get the feeling that a HuVideo version would at least be a neat novelty as well.
Looking around we might be the only damn system left without a copy of bad apple...
Atari 2600 check Ti calculator check Vectrex Check Apple II, check IMB AT/XT check Master system check Nes check Sansa clip f*cking mp3 player check
"Me too! Me too!" impressing absolutely no-one if we did it on PCE. (Sherlock Holmes did video & audio streaming, in hi-res, in 1991.)
That ship has sailed.
I'd be impressed, and that's enough...
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: Michirin9801 on March 13, 2017, 03:54:44 PM
This is a very personal opinion, but ugh, I REALLY don't like this Bad Apple remix, it doesn't even begin to compare with the original song on the PC-98, and that's because the original song is one of my least favourite ones on the PC-98 games...
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: DarkKobold on March 13, 2017, 04:47:28 PM
Looking around we might be the only damn system left without a copy of bad apple...
Atari 2600 check Ti calculator check Vectrex Check Apple II, check IMB AT/XT check Master system check Nes check Sansa clip f*cking mp3 player check
"Me too! Me too!" impressing absolutely no-one if we did it on PCE. (Sherlock Holmes did video & audio streaming, in hi-res, in 1991.)
That ship has sailed.
That is why it'd have to be done on a HuCard, like the Genesis ROM, rather than a SegaCD. It seems like the point of these remixes is to see what can be done with the limitations, and a CD with redbook audio isn't very limiting.
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: Arkhan on March 13, 2017, 05:23:34 PM
The limitations CD based bgm had were caused by the lack of any limitations whatsoever, makes you think huh
They were caused by using cheap digital studio gear in lieu of a band.
Gets you all that exercise video bgm horse shit lol
Well, there is that... :P But there's more to it than that too. Sometimes having no limitations can be creatively paralyzing, or lead to underwhelming execution that lacks cohesion or has too broad a scope. This is often due to the lack of having a usefully limiting framework to work within.
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: SignOfZeta on April 05, 2017, 12:42:16 PM
Musicians make more than programmers in Japan. If you want quality tunes you'll have to spend as much as do on graphics. Still need CD audio?
Chip tunes can be made by one guy. Shitty Yamaha keyboard music can be made by one guy. Take your pick or hire a band to record an album's worth of material for half your budget.
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: bfrasure on October 18, 2024, 01:43:38 AM
Elmer, I heard Tom made this, but did you ever run across methods of doing this?
Title: Re: HUVideo Why didn't this get used WAY more often?
Post by: elmer on November 02, 2024, 09:01:49 AM
Gulliver Boy's cinemas push 100 colors at times, but Power Golf 2's HuVideo looks like it only uses a single palette.
John Madden is also supposed to use HuVideo.
Madden's ending (after you win the championship) has this super cool inside look at the Hudson Soft offices and staff that played roles in the video clips (as players). I think the video quality of ref calls between plays is incredible! It looks better than almost any Sega CD FMV.