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NEC TG-16/TE/TurboDuo => TG-16/TE/TurboDuo Discussion => Topic started by: nat on February 05, 2007, 12:39:55 PM
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...namely, CD and HuCard.
Since this topic spans both Japanese and American-region games, it's kind of hard to pick which forum it belongs in. But since I own mostly American systems equipped with a Kisado, it's going in the American forum. Besides, the PCE sucks, anyway. :wink: TurboGrafx-16 or bust! :P
Today I was sitting at work thinking about Altered Beast (yes, this is truly how I pass the hours away) and how it was released on both CD and HuCard. Then my mental horizon expanded to include other titles that were brought out on both mediums. In the end, I was just asking myself, "Why?" In some cases the answer is more forthcoming than others.
So let's see if we can list the titles that were available on both a HuCard (I use this term loosely to include TurboChips since I can't even force myself to use that term) and CD. Also, which version is better?:
Altered Beast - Why did this game see a CD release? Does anyone know whether the HuCard or the CD came out first? Or was it a simultaneous release? Why, lord, WHY? I own the HuCard and have never played the CD but I understand the ONLY difference is the inclusion of some cutscenes. The CD version does not feature superior music, in fact, it uses the "chip" music from the HuCard. Not to mention this game will ONLY work with System Card 1.0. Why couldn't they have included the cutscenes on the HuCard and been done with it? VERDICT: CD version is superfluous. Probably has loading delays as well. Not to mention you actually have to FIND a System 1.0 card. IMHO, the CD is a downgrade in all respects. Get the HuCard.
Bonk's Adventure
Bonk's Revenge
Bomberman - Well, this is a pretty easy one. These three were released as part of the Duo's launch 4-in-1 pack-in. The CD versions are identical to the HuCard versions. Further, they promote the CD format while at the same time saving money and material. VERDICT: Save space in your cabinet/on your shelf-- get the 4-in-1 CD. Four AWESOME games on one CD, you can't go wrong. If you have a CD console, you're going to get Gate Of Thunder anyway. Now, if these had been individual CD releases that would be another story......
Bonk's 3: Bonk's Big Adventure - I remember when Bonk 3 CD came out. At the time, and for at least 10 years after, I always believed the CD came first and the HuCard was released later to make it more accessible to folks without the CD system (like me, at the time). I didn't even know there was a HuCard version I could get until around a year after the CD version was released. It wasn't until a few years ago I found out the HuCard actually came first, and the CD wasn't even released in Japan. Since I haven't played the CD version, I can't give a real quality verdict here. I HAVE, however, listened to the CD soundtrack in MP3 form and I have to say I actually PREFER the HuCard. Maybe because it's the HuCard I've always owned, but Bonk just doesn't seem right without the "chip" music. I understand there are also some additional bonus rounds on the CD version not found on the HuCard. I've never played these, but they'd have to be pretty special to sway me away from my beloved "chip" soundtrack. VERDICT: There is not much of a "why" on this one as they offered enough on the CD to justify it's release. But I'm going to go with HuCard, since that's the version I've always owned & loved.
Darius - This one's not as clear cut as the first few. On one hand, we have a HuCard which is "turbo-charged" for the SuperGrafx but features inferior music. On the other, we have a version with flickery bosses but a kick-ass Dolby-enhanced soundtrack. WHY? Why did they not combine the two and release a single CD with the enhanced soundtrack AND the SuperGrafx support? Sure, the SuperGrafx doesn't have a CD deck out of the box, but neither does the TurboGrafx or PC Engine. I've never played the SuperGrafx version, but there is a copy in the mail to me as we speak. But honestly, the flickering on the bosses is not all that bad to begin with. I'm not sure it really needed fixing. They could've spent their efforts on a game a little more in need of such help, where bosses actually completely DISAPPEAR the sprite clash is so bad (*cough* R-Type *cough*). VERDICT: I'm going to have to go with the CD here. Easier to find, cheaper, far superior soundtrack. All you lose is bosses who don't disappear before your eyes. Go for the HuCard if you have a solo SuperGrafx without a CD console. Otherwise, CD all the way.
R-Type - Ah, good ol' R-Type. Poor R-Type. Fun game with great level design, almost arcade perfect. But that damn FLICKER!! Flicker they didn't bother to fix on the CD release. Whole bosses disappear and then rematerialize right on top of you. The CD offered better quality music, but a few tunes were changed to much controversy. It also included cutscenes and an intro. It also did away with the "Credit" system and allowed unlimited continues. VERDICT: For me, it's CD version all the way. Most importantly, I can continue an unlimited number of times. In this game, this is very much needed. That aside, I personally like most of the CD music better than the "chip" tunes despite owning and playing the HuCard for years before getting the CD. Also, perhaps the biggest one-up the CD has on the HuCard is for Japanese-region players. I think everyone knows what I mean.
Sidearms HyperDyne - I don't know much about this game. I've never owned it in any form, but there is a copy in the mail to me (HuCard) right now. I played the HuCard once a long time ago somewhere and thought it would be a cool game to get at some point. Apparently, I didn't get around to that until 2007. Must not have impressed me THAT much. Either way, this makes the verdict here a tough one. As I understand it, all the CD offers the HuCard doesn't is a alternate play mode called "Before Christ". How different this is from the regular game is beyond me. VERDICT: I'm going with HuCard here. But since I really don't know what I'm talking about, take this one with a grain of salt. However, games released on CD that use "chip" music and don't take advantage of the larger storage medium don't impress me. Or does it actually have a redbook soundtrack? I don't even know.
Raiden/Super Raiden - I know even less about this game so I'm not even going to give it a verdict. In fact, is Super Raiden even the same game or is it a sequel along the lines of Super Air Zonk? I don't know. But I'm absolutely SURE someone here is about to tell me all about it.
Hmm. That's all I can think of. Any other dual format releases that I missed?
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Re: Sidearms Special.
The CD version has some great redbook audio. Sometimes I prefer the sound of the CD version, sometimes I prefer the tunes of the chip version. They're both really good.
Re: [Super] Raiden.
The game is the same as Raiden (but with an extra level??), except that your ship moves faster apparently, and the music - excellent but synthy - is on CD.
Don't forget there's also Daisenpu / Daisenpu Custom on CD.
Both Populous: Promised Lands and Neo Nectaris contain both new "games" as well as the HuCard versions on CD.
I'm sure there are others.
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:mrgreen:
http://www.pcenginefx.com/forums/index.php?topic=1479
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Err... I find it strange how someone can give verdicts on alternate versions without having tried them? :?
Altered Beast CD:
I don't mind the CD version of Altered Beast. Does the HuCard version have all of the speech? (I.E. "Power Up"?) The CD version doesn't really have a lot of loading delays. Since there isn't any red book audio, the game sort of loads as you're playing... A lot like "Tenchi O Kurau". I finally managed to find a CD1.0 control card so I'm fairly happy with the CD version of Altered Beast...
Bonk's 3: Bonk's Big Adventure
Some people might hate me for saying this, but Bonk's chip music just annoys me to no end... Especially the end of level tune. *shudder*. I pounced on Bonk 3 CD when I had the chance (I think it was released after the HuCard.) However, the annoying end of level tune is still in chip though *AARRGH* Anyway, the CD version's added bonuses levels weren't all that great, and if I remember correctly there are missing frames of animations on the giant Bonks which annoyed me more then the chip music. I traded the CD version a while back and kept the HuCard. I generally play Bonk with the volume on low. :P
Sidearms HyperDyne
I haven't played in a while, but if memory serves me correctly the "Before Christ" mode is mostly different in how the power up schemes work. AFAIR, The power up schemes work more like conventional shooters where you pick up power ups to either power up your weapon or switch to an alternate weapon (instead of the gradius like weapon selection as you pick up power ups). I think it has red book audio. I remember preferring playing the game in BC mode then the regular mode. As such, I would recommend getting the CD version.
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So far we have:
Sherlock Holmes 2,
Terraforming
Bonk's Adventure
Bonk's Revenge
Bomberman
Nectaris
Bonk 3
Jack Nicklaus Turbo Golf
Altered Beast
Populous
Side Arms
Raiden
R-Type
Super Darius
Darius Plus
Darius Alpha
and all the ACD/SCD games
We talked about Tengai Makyou Ziria a while back.
Are Space Invaders hucard and Space Invaders SCD totally different games?
What about Bikkuriman Daijikai and Bikkuriman World?
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Err... I find it strange how someone can give verdicts on alternate versions without having tried them? :?
I can since I have played at least one version of the game and I know what is different on the "other" version. Not too difficult. For example, Darius. I have not played the SuperGrafx version yet, however I know that the only thing different is lack of flicker in the boss fights. There is very little flicker in the game otherwise. Even the flicker on the bosses is pretty minor compared to some other titles. Also, I have heard the chip versions of the tunes from that HuCard. So though I have not played it, I know exactly what I will experience when I do. Since I own and love the CD soundtrack, that version gets my vote. Simple!
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Sherlock Holmes 2 was a HuCard?
Also, you can play All-Turd Beast with any CD system card.... just don't turn into the beast. The game only freezes after you turn into the beast if you're not using system card 1.0.
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I believe that Altered Beast CD has more/some ingame voice and that the HuCard version is the one that is unplayably difficult/cheap.
I haven't played much of Bonk 3 CD, but I prefer the HuCard. After I got my Turbo Duo, I usually only played the CD Bonks, but still prefer the HuCards. Especially if you have a TE or GT.
Darius Plus recycles bosses to save on memory. There's only like half of them on the HuCard, plus Super Darius has the arcade's intros and multiple endings as well as a built-in Darius Alpha. Darius Plus isn't really a loss in the music department, it has some amazing chip renditions of the great arcade/CD soundtrack. Using a SuperGrafx loses flicker on the bosses only, the rest of the minor flicker is still there.
The U.S. R-Type HuCard is awesome and has a better soundtrack than the lame R-Type Complete. The 'Complete' stands for "we almost completely ruined this game". The so called cutscenes take away from the overall experience more than they add. I'd rather play the PC Engine HuCards instead of the CD version.
The Side Arms HuCard has everything visually that the arcade port on Side Arms Special does, as well as most of the arcade perfect sounding sfx. But I believe that there are a few extra digitized effects in 'Special. The Before Christ mode has entirely redrawn graphics and different bosses. The gameplay is kinda different and the weapons aren't all exactly the same. Its basically a remix of the original. The CD soundtrack alone makes Side Arms Special a must own even if you already own the HuCard.
Sherlock Holmes 2 was a HuCard?
Also, you can play All-Turd Beast with any CD system card.... just don't turn into the beast. The game only freezes after you turn into the beast if you're not using system card 1.0.
Don't you need to be a beast for the boss to appear?
When I tried it without the 1.0 card, I found that when I got to the boss fight as a wolf, he just walked off screen and the game wouldn't begin the boss fight.
Err... I find it strange how someone can give verdicts on alternate versions without having tried them? :?
I can since I have played at least one version of the game and I know what is different on the "other" version. Not too difficult. For example, Darius. I have not played the SuperGrafx version yet, however I know that the only thing different is lack of flicker in the boss fights. There is very little flicker in the game otherwise. Even the flicker on the bosses is pretty minor compared to some other titles. Also, I have heard the chip versions of the tunes from that HuCard. So though I have not played it, I know exactly what I will experience when I do. Since I own and love the CD soundtrack, that version gets my vote. Simple!
Except that that the boss fight flicker is far from the only difference. :wink:
So far we have:
Sherlock Holmes 2,
Terraforming
Bonk's Adventure
Bonk's Revenge
Bomberman
Nectaris
Bonk 3
Jack Nicklaus Turbo Golf
Altered Beast
Populous
Side Arms
Raiden
R-Type
Super Darius
Darius Plus
Darius Alpha
and all the ACD/SCD games
We talked about Tengai Makyou Ziria a while back.
Are Space Invaders hucard and Space Invaders SCD totally different games?
What about Bikkuriman Daijikai and Bikkuriman World?
He was talking about the CD and HuCard formats. Not different CD formats.
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"Are Space Invaders hucard and Space Invaders SCD totally different games?
What about Bikkuriman Daijikai and Bikkuriman World?"
The Hucard Space Invaders, is a brand new game, kind of like Galago 88/90. The cd one, is a bunch of different versions of the original game
The cd Bikkuriman is like a quiz game, so, it's totally unconnected other then in name.
As for Bonk 3, I love the cd music, but it also doesn't fit Bonk's style. However, Bonk 3's chip music, is inferior to the first 2 games. One of these days, I might recompose all the music, for the cd version, to have the right sound to it.
Oh, & I think they mean, that Sherlock Holmes 2 could be used with 2.0, but took advantage of 3.0. Same goes for Terraforming, Macross 2036. Popful Mail, Brandish, & 3x3 Eyes can be used with 3.0 or Arcade cd, & I'm sure there are more.
Oh, & yes, do DO need the 1.0 card for Altered Beast ](*,)
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He was talking about the CD and HuCard formats. Not different CD formats.
#-o
(and yes, Sherlock 2 and Terraforming are really just CDs labeled as SCDs.)
Thanks for the info, ParanoiaDrago!
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Oh, & yes, do DO need the 1.0 card for Altered Beast
No you don't. If you encounter Neff 3 times as a human, he'll fight you. I made it up to level 2 with the Super System Card. If you turn into the beast, the screen stops scrolling. You are stuck there forever unless you happen to be using the System 1.0 card.
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Oh, & yes, do DO need the 1.0 card for Altered Beast
No you don't. If you encounter Neff 3 times as a human, he'll fight you. I made it up to level 2 with the Super System Card. If you turn into the beast, the screen stops scrolling. You are stuck there forever unless you happen to be using the System 1.0 card.
I guess I only did a couple laps through the level before giving up. :clap:
He was talking about the CD and HuCard formats. Not different CD formats.
#-o
(and yes, Sherlock 2 and Terraforming are really just CDs labeled as SCDs.)
Thanks for the info, ParanoiaDrago!
I still think that all so called bicompatible CDs are just the lower format with an extra label on the package. I will until someone can show some hard evidence to the contrary.
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I believe that Altered Beast CD has more/some ingame voice and that the HuCard version is the one that is unplayably difficult/cheap.
I don't think the game is unfair at all. I have the HuCard and I can get to level 3 without using a continue. I only got the game two months ago. I used to play on the Genesis back in the day. I don't feel the HuCard is any more difficult than the Genesis cart was. It's just a matter of memorizing where and when the enemies are goin to pop up and devise evasion tactics. I actually think it's a pretty fun game.
The U.S. R-Type HuCard is awesome and has a better soundtrack than the lame R-Type Complete. The 'Complete' stands for "we almost completely ruined this game". The so called cutscenes take away from the overall experience more than they add. I'd rather play the PC Engine HuCards instead of the CD version.
[-X We'll have to agree to disagree here.
The Side Arms HuCard has everything visually that the arcade port on Side Arms Special does, as well as most of the arcade perfect sounding sfx. But I believe that there are a few extra digitized effects in 'Special. The Before Christ mode has entirely redrawn graphics and different bosses. The gameplay is kinda different and the weapons aren't all exactly the same. Its basically a remix of the original. The CD soundtrack alone makes Side Arms Special a must own even if you already own the HuCard.
The inclusion of a CD soundtrack might sway me a bit. I was under the impression the CD just recycled the chip music.
Darius Plus recycles bosses to save on memory. There's only like half of them on the HuCard, plus Super Darius has the arcade's intros and multiple endings as well as a built-in Darius Alpha. Darius Plus isn't really a loss in the music department, it has some amazing chip renditions of the great arcade/CD soundtrack. Using a SuperGrafx loses flicker on the bosses only, the rest of the minor flicker is still there.
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Except that that the boss fight flicker is far from the only difference. :wink:
This new information just goes to further solidify my verdict that the CD is the superior version. 8)
He was talking about the CD and HuCard formats. Not different CD formats.
Right-o.
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bikkuriman daijikai is a complete different game and only based on the bikkuriman theme. nothing to do with the wonderboy in monsterland clone ;)
OMG, how i wished a CD version of Street fighter II' as well or even better a Turbo SF II. using ACD technology on the grafical level of a Garou densetsu special. it would kick the SFC's ass directly to hell.
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bikkuriman daijikai is a complete different game and only based on the bikkuriman theme. nothing to do with the wonderboy in monsterland clone ;)
OMG, how i wished a CD version of Street fighter II' as well or even better a Turbo SF II. using ACD technology on the grafical level of a Garou densetsu special. it would kick the SFC's ass directly to hell.
Screw that, how about some expert homebrewers whip us up some ACD Street Fighter Alpha 3? :P
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Oh, & yes, do DO need the 1.0 card for Altered Beast
No you don't. If you encounter Neff 3 times as a human, he'll fight you. I made it up to level 2 with the Super System Card. If you turn into the beast, the screen stops scrolling. You are stuck there forever unless you happen to be using the System 1.0 card.
That's true, I just always think about, turning into the beast, which as you say, the screen stops scrolling. Is it actually possible to beat the bosses without turning into the beasts??
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Maybe someone already mentioned them but how about Davis Cup and Andre Panza Kickboxing?
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OMG, how i wished a CD version of Street fighter II' as well or even better a Turbo SF II. using ACD technology on the grafical level of a Garou densetsu special. it would kick the SFC's ass directly to hell.
I often think about the choices the programmers made about the medium they chose. Why CD for Street Fighter I? Why HuCard for Street Fighter II? As it is, the HuCard of SF2 can hold it's own against the SNES port. But think how much an ACD could've blown away all other versions.
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and "熱血高校ドッジボール部PCサッカー編" nekketsu koukou dodgeball bun PC soccer hen :)
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I often think about the choices the programmers made about the medium they chose. Why CD for Street Fighter I? Why HuCard for Street Fighter II?
for Fighting Street, they only liked to use the new medium CD-ROM at that time. no big deals there, i believe. as for the HuCard for SFII', may they choosed this medium to remove any loading time. and the use of the new 20Mbit HuCard invention as well :mrgreen:
As it is, the HuCard of SF2 can hold it's own against the SNES port. But think how much an ACD could've blown away all other versions.
that's all about!
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OMG, how i wished a CD version of Street fighter II' as well or even better a Turbo SF II. using ACD technology on the grafical level of a Garou densetsu special. it would kick the SFC's ass directly to hell.
I often think about the choices the programmers made about the medium they chose. Why CD for Street Fighter I? Why HuCard for Street Fighter II? As it is, the HuCard of SF2 can hold it's own against the SNES port. But think how much an ACD could've blown away all other versions.
I always held out hope for an ACD of like SSFTTurbo or something. But when SFIICE came out, Super CD was the standard at the time. The Turbo Duo & System 3.0 card weren't even out yet in North America.
When Fighting Street came out, HuCards were only 2 megs with the possible rare 4 meg'er. I don't think that FS or Monster Lair would've turned out anywhere near as good on HuCard.
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I thought the PC Engine version of Street Fighter II turbo was better than the SNES & Genesis versions visually, but the music was kind of weak, like they just ran the arcade music through a program that converted it to PCE chip music instead of recomposing it for the system. It definitely plays awesome with a 6 button pad.
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The Side Arms HuCard has everything visually that the arcade port on Side Arms Special does, as well as most of the arcade perfect sounding sfx. But I believe that there are a few extra digitized effects in 'Special. The Before Christ mode has entirely redrawn graphics and different bosses. The gameplay is kinda different and the weapons aren't all exactly the same. Its basically a remix of the original. The CD soundtrack alone makes Side Arms Special a must own even if you already own the HuCard.
The inclusion of a CD soundtrack might sway me a bit. I was under the impression the CD just recycled the chip music.
You can find the HuCard for a pretty good price, I'd reckon. Get that if you want to play it safe.
However, I would definitely recommend getting the CD version. Nice soundtrack + BC mode = great deal.
I still play the HuCard when I want to hear some chiptunes... so you can't lose either way.
And, quickly... R-Type complete... I agree with B_T: the cinemas aren't anything to get excited about (sad but true). The soundtrack is interesting simply because it doesn't sound like a generic re-hash of the classic tunes. If you are a big R-type fan, then get the CD for the novelty of the redbook alone, if nothing else.
Super Raiden: search these forums for rolins + Super Raiden. He made an exhaustive comparison of the HuCard vs. CD. My advice is the same I gave you for Sidearms: get the cheap HuCard first, but you won't be disappointed by the CD. TWO extra levels in Super Raiden, plus a TRULY amazing redbook soundtrack that is faithful to the HuCard but still manages to impress. R-Type Complete redbook might not be everyone's cup of tea, but Super Raiden will not disappoint fans!
And, since I know that you are a definitely going to buy Jack Nicklaus Championship Golf, go for the CD version!
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In the end, I was just asking myself, "Why?" In some cases the answer is more forthcoming than others.
You must be a PCE late-comer or something. The "why" is simple. Anything on CD was exciting at the time. Those primitive cinemas were considered super kick-ass in 1992. Many PC Engine games are almost nothing but cinema.
Mainly after the release of the CDROM2 HuCards were developed because the userbase was larger. Not everyone had the money to blow on CDROM add-ons or Duos. This is why Bomberman '94 was a Hucard. Same with Darkwing Duck.
CD remakes were released mainly to add CD audio and cinemas to games people already liked. Usually they came out months or years after the HuCard. The same thing happened on Sega CD with stuff like Sol Feace/Sol Deace, Eternal Champions. The Sega CD also had a few situations where the CD version of the game was a poorly thrown together cash-in attempt just to get titles on CD. The worst example was probably Mortal Kombat, which was a broken POS compared to the cart...well, every version of MK ever is a broken POS, but that's beside the point.
I don't find these choices to be puzzling at all. I would have bought with out hesitation CDROM versions of Aeroblasters, Burning Angels, Street Fighter II, Ninja Spirit etc. Or, on the Sega CD, CDROM versions of The Adventures of Batman and Robin (a perfect chance for a re-release to fix the difficulty!) or Thunder Force III.
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I thought the PC Engine version of Street Fighter II turbo was better than the SNES & Genesis versions visually, but the music was kind of weak, like they just ran the arcade music through a program that converted it to PCE chip music instead of recomposing it for the system. It definitely plays awesome with a 6 button pad.
IMO not true for the SFC version. the MD version is beaten easily indeed.
IMO the sfc version is better in all points of view. visually, soundish, technically (line scrolling etc.) and the SFC pad had one of the best cross ever. badly was only the weakness of the L/R-shoulder buttons. how many time i broke them!!?
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I still think that all so called bicompatible CDs are just the lower format with an extra label on the package. I will until someone can show some hard evidence to the contrary.
Well, for CD/SCD bicompatible, there's the 3rd Ranma game. Pop it in and change between guy Ranma and girl Ranma during the battles. You'll see some loading with ver 2.x (and below) and no loading with ver 3.0 (slight pause though). That's the only example I can think of offhand for CD/SCD where I've seen differences.
For SCD/ACD, I know there was a thread on this before. Most bicompatible SCD/ACD titles used the arcade card just for caching data. Emerald Dragon and Flash Hiders are two examples of this.
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IMO not true for the SFC version. the MD version is beaten easily indeed.
IMO the sfc version is better in all points of view. visually, soundish, technically (line scrolling etc.)
But all 3 versions of SFII (SFC, MD, PCE) have the line scrolling on the floor. What made you think they didn't?
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In the end, I was just asking myself, "Why?" In some cases the answer is more forthcoming than others.
You must be a PCE late-comer or something. The "why" is simple. Anything on CD was exciting at the time. Those primitive cinemas were considered super kick-ass in 1992. Many PC Engine games are almost nothing but cinema.
I've owned a TurboGrafx since 1990.
I couldn't afford a CD add-on until 1996 or so.
If that makes me a latecomer, so be it, but I would tend to disagree.
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The Side Arms HuCard has everything visually that the arcade port on Side Arms Special does, as well as most of the arcade perfect sounding sfx. But I believe that there are a few extra digitized effects in 'Special. The Before Christ mode has entirely redrawn graphics and different bosses. The gameplay is kinda different and the weapons aren't all exactly the same. Its basically a remix of the original. The CD soundtrack alone makes Side Arms Special a must own even if you already own the HuCard.
The inclusion of a CD soundtrack might sway me a bit. I was under the impression the CD just recycled the chip music.
You can find the HuCard for a pretty good price, I'd reckon. Get that if you want to play it safe.
Already done so. Picked one up on an eBay auction last week for $13 after shipping. It's in the mail to me now.
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But all 3 versions of SFII (SFC, MD, PCE) have the line scrolling on the floor. What made you think they didn't?
how the linescrolling shows up :D
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Well its not like there's a huge difference between all 3 versions, but I think the PCE version looks nicest and has the best sprites and floor scrolling.
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I thought the PC Engine version of Street Fighter II turbo was better than the SNES & Genesis versions visually, but the music was kind of weak, like they just ran the arcade music through a program that converted it to PCE chip music instead of recomposing it for the system. It definitely plays awesome with a 6 button pad.
Although Capcom clearly didn't take the time to polish up the tunes to make them sound as nice as they could've (just as they didn't bother to take the time to program in some seperate scrolling bg's), I think that the PC Engine's soundtrack is probably the best overall, because it's such a seemingly straight port of the original music.
I'm talking the actual music/composition/whatever, not simply to types of 'instruments' used for each channel. I didn't necessarily think so before I recorded the PCE & MD soundtracks and sampled the arcade and SFC soundtracks.
Although its sometimes nice to have crazy sounding electro instruments pounding out game music, even parts of the arcade soundtrack don't sound as good musically because of the sounds used for some sections.
But all 3 versions of SFII (SFC, MD, PCE) have the line scrolling on the floor. What made you think they didn't?
how the linescrolling shows up :D
I don't know if you mean the seperate scrolling bg's or the warping floors, but there not really much difference in the 'quality' of the warping floors that anyone would notice while playing(if there is any difference at all). Its not like the SNES or arcade versions used Mode 7 foor the floors.
But I also don't think that the 3DO SSFIIT looks worse than the SNES SSFII just because it has static bg's.
One thing the PCE version definitely does do better than the Genesis/SNES versions is the sfx/voice samples.
And the PCE version plays great even with a 2 button pad. :)
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I don't know if you mean the seperate scrolling bg's or the warping floors, but there not really much difference in the 'quality' of the warping floors that anyone would notice while playing(if there is any difference at all). Its not like the SNES or arcade versions used Mode 7 foor the floors.
But I also don't think that the 3DO SSFIIT looks worse than the SNES SSFII just because it has static bg's.
One thing the PCE version definitely does do better than the Genesis/SNES versions is the sfx/voice samples.
And the PCE version plays great even with a 2 button pad. :)
the linescrolling of course is the warping floor in your words. and i'm certainly sure that the SFC version looks much smoother and regulary than the other pendants. and about the sfx/voice samples, i have to compare those two versions again, but i never had the impression that the SFC SFII sounds bad in any kind of audio aspects :)
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I don't know if you mean the seperate scrolling bg's or the warping floors, but there not really much difference in the 'quality' of the warping floors that anyone would notice while playing(if there is any difference at all). Its not like the SNES or arcade versions used Mode 7 foor the floors.
But I also don't think that the 3DO SSFIIT looks worse than the SNES SSFII just because it has static bg's.
One thing the PCE version definitely does do better than the Genesis/SNES versions is the sfx/voice samples.
And the PCE version plays great even with a 2 button pad. :)
the linescrolling of course is the warping floor in your words. and i'm certainly sure that the SFC version looks much smoother and regulary than the other pendants. and about the sfx/voice samples, i have to compare those two versions again, but i never had the impression that the SFC SFII sounds bad in any kind of audio aspects :)
The SFC SFII games have great voice/sfx. The PCE versions are just a little better and I belive that the PCE version has a few more than at least SFC SFII WW.
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Although Capcom clearly didn't take the time to polish up the tunes to make them sound as nice as they could've (just as they didn't bother to take the time to program in some seperate scrolling bg's), I think that the PC Engine's soundtrack is probably the best overall, because it's such a seemingly straight port of the original music.
Agreed. Even though the Genesis version of Championship edition seems to add more instruments and what not in some songs, I found the PCE version to have the best soundtrack of the Genesis and SNES.
Another cool thing about the PCE version I noticed is that you can't throw people immediately after doing a Psycho Crusher with M. Bison, that is if the opponent blocked the attack. I would have to test this out in the arcade verison, but I know that you can do that cheap throw in Super for Geneis (and arcade as well I believe). I tried this out on different versions before, but I can't remember the results.
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The same thing happened on Sega CD with stuff like Sol Feace/Sol Deace
Well, yes and no. The CD version of Sol Feace, Earnest Evans and Heavy Nova came out in Japan before the cartridge versions existed (which were only released in the US). The CD versions were only released in Japan (with the exception of Sol Feces).
I don't find these choices to be puzzling at all. I would have bought with out hesitation ... on the Sega CD, CDROM versions of The Adventures of Batman and Robin
There was a Sega CD version of "The Adventures of Batman and Robin" made by the same development team that did the Genesis version. They just changed the entire game into a scaling/rotating driving game which was every bit as hard.
I like da music on da CD version of R-Type Compleet it iz teh gud!
The music from the R-Type Special album BLOWS AWAY R-Type Complete. It totally anal-rapes it and leaves it bleeding in the rain while passers-by point and laugh at it.
Teh line scrollz on teh snesxorz r teh best!!!1!!
I don't think so. I am a huge fan of line scrolls and have a Phd in line scrolls from Harvard. There really isn't much difference in the line scrolls on the 3 versions of Street Fighter II (I refuse to put the apostrophe after the "II" because that is just gay).
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There was a Sega CD version of "The Adventures of Batman and Robin" made by the same development team that did the Genesis version. They just changed the entire game into a scaling/rotating driving game which was every bit as hard.
Oh good so I'm not the only person who found that game to be hard as shit!
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They do that on purpose... that way they don't need to make as many levels since nobody could possibly ever see them all.
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I don't know if this counts, but Brandish is a Super CD-ROM2 and Arcade Card
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I thought the PC Engine version of Street Fighter II turbo was better than the SNES & Genesis versions visually, but the music was kind of weak, like they just ran the arcade music through a program that converted it to PCE chip music instead of recomposing it for the system. It definitely plays awesome with a 6 button pad.
Although Capcom clearly didn't take the time to polish up the tunes to make them sound as nice as they could've (just as they didn't bother to take the time to program in some seperate scrolling bg's), I think that the PC Engine's soundtrack is probably the best overall, because it's such a seemingly straight port of the original music.
I'm talking the actual music/composition/whatever, not simply to types of 'instruments' used for each channel. I didn't necessarily think so before I recorded the PCE & MD soundtracks and sampled the arcade and SFC soundtracks.
Although its sometimes nice to have crazy sounding electro instruments pounding out game music, even parts of the arcade soundtrack don't sound as good musically because of the sounds used for some sections.
OK, I'm being lazy here, but is there a sound test for SFII PCE? I don't remember buying it, but somehow I recently got the HuCard and this thread got me curious about the music.
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OK, I'm being lazy here, but is there a sound test for SFII PCE? I don't remember buying it, but somehow I recently got the HuCard and this thread got me curious about the music.
(http://superpcenginegrafx.com/img/sfst.gif)
I didn't have a discman other than my Turbo CD when I left on a 7 day road trip the same day SFIICE arrived in the mail. So when I took breaks from trying to beat the game on the highest difficulty without losing a round to possibly open up Turbo mode or something, I listened to the soundtracks of SFIICE and Dungeon Explorer to pass the time.
If you're still feeling lazy, you can just listen to the soundtrack on mp3 I recorded off of real actual hardware-
http://superpcenginegrafx.com/worldwarrior.mp3
I've also got a bunch more under the Music section of my site. I believe that the SFIICE mp3 is the old one that I forgot to add the post match music to. I've been too lazy to find the re-edited one and convert and upload it, so i'll have to do for now. :wink:
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OK, I'm being lazy here, but is there a sound test for SFII PCE? I don't remember buying it, but somehow I recently got the HuCard and this thread got me curious about the music.
Yes there is.
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bikkuriman daijikai is a complete different game and only based on the bikkuriman theme. nothing to do with the wonderboy in monsterland clone ;)
OMG, how i wished a CD version of Street fighter II' as well or even better a Turbo SF II. using ACD technology on the grafical level of a Garou densetsu special. it would kick the SFC's ass directly to hell.
Screw that, how about some expert homebrewers whip us up some ACD Street Fighter Alpha 3? :P
As stupid as this sounds,I would actually like to see Mortal Kombat 1 ported over,just to see how it would look and run with a Arcade card Pro. One of the Alphas would be great too. I think the problem here would be these projects would be huge,so i don't expect anyone to undertake this pressure driven madness.
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OK, I'm being lazy here, but is there a sound test for SFII PCE? I don't remember buying it, but somehow I recently got the HuCard and this thread got me curious about the music.
(http://superpcenginegrafx.com/img/sfst.gif)
I didn't have a discman other than my Turbo CD when I left on a 7 day road trip the same day SFIICE arrived in the mail. So when I took breaks from trying to beat the game on the highest difficulty without losing a round to possibly open up Turbo mode or something, I listened to the soundtracks of SFIICE and Dungeon Explorer to pass the time.
If you're still feeling lazy, you can just listen to the soundtrack on mp3 I recorded off of real actual hardware-
http://superpcenginegrafx.com/worldwarrior.mp3
I've also got a bunch more under the Music section of my site. I believe that the SFIICE mp3 is the old one that I forgot to add the post match music to. I've been too lazy to find the re-edited one and convert and upload it, so i'll have to do for now. :wink:
Ha! Perfect. I'm listening to your mp3 as I type this. I haven't played any of my consoles since I moved (July / August 2006!) because I can't find the box with all of my AC/DC adapters.
I love DE chiptunes... I could listen to them all day. SFII, on the other hand...
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As stupid as this sounds,I would actually like to see Mortal Kombat 1 ported over,just to see how it would look and run with a Arcade card Pro. One of the Alphas would be great too. I think the problem here would be these projects would be huge,so i don't expect anyone to undertake this pressure driven madness.
Crazy hombrewers putting out stuff like this gives me hope-
http://sega-16.com/Hacks%20Homebrews-%20Top%20Fighter%202000.php (http://sega-16.com/Hacks Homebrews- Top Fighter 2000.php)
Well its not like there's a huge difference between all 3 versions, but I think the PCE version looks nicest and has the best sprites and floor scrolling.
I think that the Genesis version looks amazing and very colorful, considering it's supposed color limitations. Especially compared to the initial straight port Capcom did. On an old TV back in the day, it basically looked as good as the other 2 versions, only a little blurry.
What I don't like about the Genesis version is all the little details that are a little off. I like the sound of parts of the music better than the other versions, but its too much of a mixed bag overall.
I think that SSFII SNES is underrated and it was retarded of game mags back then to trash it as offering 'nothing new', while they praised MKII & III and had no problem earlier with the true minor update of SFII Turbo.
I'd still really like to see a PCE port of SSFII.
What made/makes SFIICE on PCE so special, is that particularly back in the day, the pros told us it was impossible and that any form of SFII on PCE would at best be severely flawed visually and aurally, because the TG-16 is so terrible.
And even though Capcom couldn't be bothered to publish it themselves, their seemingly rushed port at the very least holds its own with the other versions.
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I'd still really like to see a PCE port of SSFII.
I'd really like to see a PCE port of SSFIIT :) .
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I perfer SSF2 on Genesis over Snes. I also run my Genesis in s-video so thats prob why. When I ran the game on Snes in s-video it just still did not look as well as the genesis version to me. as far as champ edition goes,I like the Pc-Engine one the most,even over Snes SF2 Turbo version. That bootleg rom was cool,esp the SNK and Capcom sprites in it. it shows full screen and the sprites are large. Makes me really wish someone would port over Alpha to Genesis homebrew. If the meg size was large enough,it could def do it. Be neat if the same was done on Pc-Engine too.
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Sega was always about "Mega Power" so there would be plenty of megs to do what needed to be done. If not, I'd loan them a few.
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Teh line scrollz on teh snesxorz r teh best!!!1!!
I don't think so. I am a huge fan of line scrolls and have a Phd in line scrolls from Harvard. There really isn't much difference in the line scrolls on the 3 versions of Street Fighter II (I refuse to put the apostrophe after the "II" because that is just gay).
1. IMO not true. when you compare the line scroll of the SFC to the one of the PCE version, you may find out, that when you walk to the end of each screen sides, the line scroll of the PCE version is slightly displaced. therefore a kind of perspective/parallax error appears. also i believe that the SFC line scroll uses a higher resolution, which let it appear smoother in generally. that why the sfc l1n3 5cr0llz rox0rz teh most!!
2. and why in name of god the "dash" apostrophe looks gay?
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I actually kinda love the apostrophe. Maybe I'm gay?
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I don't know why it looks gay, it just does. Just another example of Japan anal-raping the English language, perhaps? Kind of like capitalizing every letter except for the "i" in "Nights". And the apostrophe certainly isn't a dash! That makes it even more gay. Keranu you are not gay since you refer to it as an apostrophe.
Anyway, line scrolling is exactly what it sounds like... scrolling lines. Each line scrolls at a slightly different speed. So unless the SNES floor is actually bigger than the PCE floor, then the "resolution" of the line scroll would be identical.
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Anyway, line scrolling is exactly what it sounds like... scrolling lines. Each line scrolls at a slightly different speed.
sorry, you didn't understod well what i wrote. whilein the sfc version the speed of each line is proportional to its perspective/parallax, in the pce version it's not, therefore you can see some gaps/stairs on the floormodel when you scroll to the screen end. can you follow me now?
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I don't know why it looks gay, it just does. Just another example of Japan anal-raping the English language, perhaps? Kind of like capitalizing every letter except for the "i" in "Nights". And the apostrophe certainly isn't a dash! That makes it even more gay. Keranu you are not gay since you refer to it as an apostrophe.
I know! Why on Earth do the Japanese pronounce it as "DASH" on the commercial!? WhaaaAAAaaaaaat in the hell is THAT supposed to mean!? :D
Maybe they added an apostrophe because they were intending to name it "Street Fighter II's PC Engine Hot Converting Fun Fun!"?
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They were gonna name it "Street Fighter II's da Phiggidy Phat Bomb Yo" but they ran out of time and had to stop typing.
Tatsujin, I think you're trying to say something like:
SNES
Line 1 scrolls at 3 pixels per second
Line 2 scrolls at 4 pixels per second
Line 3 scrolls at 5 pixels per second
PC Engine
Line 1 scrolls at 3 pixels per second
Line 2 scrolls at 4.5 pixels per second
Line 3 scrolls at 6 pixels per second
Result: teh jaggyz
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SFII' > SFII- > SFII_
And that, my friends, is a mathematical fact.
Now, too bad they didn't go with something that was kooler, like: SFII+
Regardless, we should be grateful that they didn't entitle it SFII" (double dash!)
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Tatsujin, I think you're trying to say something like:
Result: teh jaggyz
nope, sorry..still not exactly.
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I don't know why it looks gay, it just does. Just another example of Japan anal-raping the English language, perhaps? Kind of like capitalizing every letter except for the "i" in "Nights". And the apostrophe certainly isn't a dash! That makes it even more gay. Keranu you are not gay since you refer to it as an apostrophe.
Anyway, line scrolling is exactly what it sounds like... scrolling lines. Each line scrolls at a slightly different speed. So unless the SNES floor is actually bigger than the PCE floor, then the "resolution" of the line scroll would be identical.
Its not an apostrophe, its a flamboyant dash. Hence the title 'Street Fighter II Dash' and the feeling of geyness you get from looking at it. :wink:
SFII' > SFII- > SFII_
And that, my friends, is a mathematical fact.
Now, too bad they didn't go with something that was kooler, like: SFII+
Regardless, we should be grateful that they didn't entitle it SFII" (double dash!)
Actually, the japanese Megadrive version of the U.S. game "Street Fighter II Special Champion Edition" is titled "Street Fighter II' Plus" with the words Champion Edition kinda just floating around the package like the PCE version. :P
Anyway, line scrolling is exactly what it sounds like... scrolling lines. Each line scrolls at a slightly different speed.
sorry, you didn't understod well what i wrote. whilein the sfc version the speed of each line is proportional to its perspective/parallax, in the pce version it's not, therefore you can see some gaps/stairs on the floormodel when you scroll to the screen end. can you follow me now?
Even if the PCE version's floor is slightly jaggier than the SFC version, its not anything that stands out or is jaggier than the rest of the on screen graphics.
But regardless, the graphics being scrolled in the first place are nicer/more colorful on the PCE version.
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I don't know why it looks gay, it just does. Just another example of Japan anal-raping the English language, perhaps? Kind of like capitalizing every letter except for the "i" in "Nights". And the apostrophe certainly isn't a dash! That makes it even more gay. Keranu you are not gay since you refer to it as an apostrophe.
Anyway, line scrolling is exactly what it sounds like... scrolling lines. Each line scrolls at a slightly different speed. So unless the SNES floor is actually bigger than the PCE floor, then the "resolution" of the line scroll would be identical.
Its not an apostrophe, its a flamboyant dash. Hence the title 'Street Fighter II Dash' and the feeling of geyness you get from looking at it. :wink:
That's it: the flamboyant dash. End of story. :)
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If it were flamboyant it would be pink and be wearing leather chaps. It is a hetero apostrophe that Japan used in an attempt to rape the English language because Japanese people aren't very smart.
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I think Joe's right.
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If it were flamboyant it would be pink and be wearing leather chaps. It is a hetero apostrophe that Japan used in an attempt to rape the English language because Japanese people aren't very smart.
You can't tell me that the "Street Fighter II Turbo" logo isn't totally flaming. =;
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Few days late into this thread, but like guts said, the 3 home versions are not too far off from each other. It really is interesting how there's no consensus on what people think is the best "16-bit" version. I myself enjoy the pce version as I think along the same line along as black_tiger:
What made/makes SFIICE on PCE so special, is that particularly back in the day, the pros told us it was impossible and that any form of SFII on PCE would at best be severely flawed visually and aurally, because the TG-16 is so terrible.
- It's just awesome seeing this game on the pce.
And this issue...
I still think that all so called bicompatible CDs are just the lower format with an extra label on the package. I will until someone can show some hard evidence to the contrary.
Agh, I can't find it, but I do recall someone verifying that Brandish was pre-loading some town portion(?) of the data into the ACD RAM - and this was actually done by verifying that code being loaded in the ACD RAM as opposed to a seat-of-the-pants observation. I guess it was verified on a emulator. I'll see if I can find that link another time. And according to the Gulliver Boy manual, the FMV supposedly loads faster with the ACD card, but that's just what the manual states, IIRC.
I can't quite speak for the other SCD/ACD games.
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You can't tell me that the "Street Fighter II Turbo" logo isn't totally flaming.
And I won't!
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I think Joe's right.
not that correct at all. i think the problem lies in the fact, that the japanese really can't speak any english :lol:
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Hey now I always hear Japanese people saying things like "Lets go!", "Burn, burn!", "YEAH!", and stuff :D .
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Burn burn!
What other words would anyone possibly need to know?