DSP in a HuCard & Max Storage Size of a HuCard

[SeymorOnion]

Wait, I don't see how SuperCD was a limited medium for Mysterious Song. Cutscenes, yeah, but good map design which promotes reasonable loading breaks should free you from most RPG limitations. Just avoid huge sections that need a single load.

Back to the HuCard issue... I'd much rather see some scratch RAM on a HuCard than a DSP. Even a little 128 kibit blorp of read/write RAM that the CPU could use to decompress data into or use for storing extra variable and data would be fantastic. The question is, how much additional complexity would a RAM/ROM mapper and a small RAM chip add? This would, effectively, be the SuperCD Card of HuCards.

Ah, my bad. I just re-read your thread (bold mine).
Now, that sounds interesting!

[nodtveidt]

Populous had onboard RAM because of the immense amount of data it had to process. 32KB, to be exact... which is plenty. 128KB would help for complex decompression, but if you're already going the way of mega-massive hucard designs, chances are that decompression of stuff might not even going to be required... unless you're making the mother of all hucard RPGs.

[Arkhan]

Yeah, menus can be a pain. When I talk about tracking variables, what I mean is that RPGs typically feature quite a bit of bookkeeping of variables, not just of the various characters stats, but when there are side quests and inventory to track and such, there's just a good bit of data to shepherd.

There is alot of data to keep track of in ANY game.  Even something simple, like Insanity, has a shit-load of crap to deal with at any given time.  Atlantean is actively dealing with as many sprites as the PCE can handle (and more), and tracking various bits of information for each one of them.  There are pros and cons to any type of game.   You avoid the problems in one game, and have them in another.    MSR is pretty safe in the sprite-world (from what I gather), but in the "goddamn theres alot of data" world, it's got issues. 

Especially, as OldMan said, when you are dealing with variables that need to exist in any portion of the game.  you can't stop tracking your parties stats, or the flags for their progress in the game.  You have certain portions of the game that always need to exist in memory.

Even with the best development tools ever, you are stuck with a limited game in that regard.  Look at Cosmic Fantasy, the Ys games,  and basically ANY RPG for the system.  We're talking about companies with years of experience on those platforms, with the best tools possible, and there are STILL limitations.  It's not HuC's fault with this.    You will encounter this no matter what.  HuC's real problem comes from accessing things quickly.  This isn't so much of an issue with an RPG.  The problem is just having it all fit regardless. 

I would strongly suggest you experience HuC before making statements about what HuC is or isn't doing right.

Funny you should say that. RPGs proliferated on early PCs because early PCs were not especially good with actiony kinds of games, but even with limited RAM and CPU speed, RPGs were the perfect game for the hardware. The PCE's system design seems slightly less well-suited to RPGs than the competition, but then again, the NES did have some impressive RPGs on it.

This is false.  The Apple II had plenty of good to great action titles. So did the C64 and the Atari computers.  They handled smooth action very well, even early on.

The real reason RPGs came out of the woodwork on computers is because thats the only platform you had at the time.  It had a keyboard.  This is very important, especially since the idea was to recreate D&D style gaming, which includes conversing (Ultima).  Ultima came out at a time where your only option was a computer.  A computer that could do action games too.  Horizon V for Apple II is a pretty solid action game.

Computers had technically infinite (limited by how many disks you want your game to come with) storage.

What was your other option, an Atari 2600? f*ck that.  Swordquest? lol.

Saying the PCE's system design is not well suited to RPGs does not make much sense, as it is more capable than a system like the C64, which contains many power-house RPGs like Legacy of the Ancients.

I mean, the PCE CD has Might and Magic III and five Wizardry games.  They blow away the PC counterparts, easily. 

The PCE is more capable than the NES as well.  Everything the NES did RPG wise, the PCE did, or could do far better.

[thesteve]

the need for an upper and lower (upper mapped, lower not) is over stated.
if you map all the addresses, you just need to mirror the base code to each mapped bank.
if your base code (the part that must be readable at all times) is less than 256K that offers even more flexibility.

[spenoza]

I would strongly suggest you experience HuC before making statements about what HuC is or isn't doing right.

I wasn't asserting factually what HuC is or isn't good for. I was pointing out that it sounded like the explanation put the blame on HuC. I was attempting to draw conclusions from information someone else provided, based on how they worded that information.

Saying the PCE's system design is not well suited to RPGs does not make much sense, as it is more capable than a system like the C64, which contains many power-house RPGs like Legacy of the Ancients.

...

The PCE is more capable than the NES as well.  Everything the NES did RPG wise, the PCE did, or could do far better.

See, I would naturally assume that the C64 or Apple II would be better suited to RPGs due to having more RAM and bitmap graphics modes.

I had an Apple IIc. I had lots of action games. Some of them were fun. None of them were particularly smooth except Lode Runner.

It would be hard to argue the PCE isn't more capable than the NES. You'll find I never stated otherwise.

[Arkhan]

Horizon 5 is very smooth. 

Most apple ii games are in fact very smooth.  They just look funny.  I was pretty surprised at the fluidity of alot of the games, AND the controls.   The C64 often controls like shit.

Bitmap graphic modes are practically irrelevant in the equation as far as an advantage for RPGs.  You are aware that Wizardry is tile-based on some machines (the MSX), and that Ultima moves tile-based as well.

The fact that they didn't HAVE tile modes was a bit of a crippler at times.   Ultima would have been a breeze to program with a dedicated sprite/tile mode instead of bitmapped. 

and, the dungeons are all static/prerendered sections anyway, so really, they are using bitmapped mode to do what a tile based mode would do easier. 

Just sayin'


And, you said the PCE seems less geared for RPGs than its competitors.  That includes the NES, no?