The New TZD.COM

[Necromancer]

i don't know where they got their stock from but i have a really good guess: i have been saying for a while that telegames.co.uk has the only real good stock of games left (outside of tzd).  ncs got a bunch of stuff in last year at STEALS but it was all PCE.  in any case, i'd rather give tzd $100 for a sealed game than ebay.

Giving the current TZD $100 for a sealed game is giving it to an ebay store (redfrog's only presence before buying TZD).  I do agree with you that redfrog has a few good deals though; at least as good as the old TZD's non-sale prices and often cheaper in their auctions (quite a few  start at $.99 and end between $10-15).

[Sinistron]

Geepee- If Redfrog wasn't flying the TZD flag then perhaps they'd be judged on different merits.  As it stands however- old TZD disclaimed right on their site that they didn't associate or advocate buying from Ebay sellers- which is precisely what Redfrog is- only difference is that they're the worst kind of EBay seller- the kind that has already told Mike H here that their intent is to inflate the market prices of some of these games, the kind that buys up sealed items (and now used as well) on EBay itself before any true fan can get to 'em and then resells them for at least double the price.  The kind that now inexplicably sells XBox stuff and other non Turbo crap on its "TZD" page.  

And Dynastic Hero US is rare- but not THAT rare and not THAT expensive.  They know it, the informed here know it- you would do yourself good to know it as well.

I was willing to give them a chance- but seeing some of these prices, seeing that TZD is now a place that is no longer exclusive to TG- and seeing them snap up on Ebay with intent to resell to us with inflated pricing- makes me sick.

Necro's right- there are a few good deals that they have- but they need something to try to get back into our good graces- otherwise we'd all be in total agreement here and none of us would order from them.

Sadly- feeling all this- I placed one order with them since the change.  I bought a turbo pad repair cable- not knowing where else to go and not wanting to toss the pad in the trash.  Does that make me a hypocrite?  Maybe.  I refuse to buy any games from them however- and I feel ashamed even for buying the repair cable.  :oops:  I gladly submit my bare back here for the cat o' nine tails.

[ceti alpha]

Haha sin. Shame on you!! 

Seriously though, the repair cables are actually a good deal. But yeah, I can't believe that Redfrog actually came right out and said to Mike what their intentions are. lol What a bunch of jerks. 

[vestcoat]

anyone who can score sealed copies of two great WD games and not rip us off has to be alright.

Well, I hate to say it, but you still got ripped off.  Sealed copies of CS2 and Exile have been widely available ever since Game Quest Direct bought the remaining Working Designs stock and prices have fallen dramatically.  In the completed listings on ebay, four of the last five sealed copies of CS2 went for $10-20; as did three of the last four copies of Exile.  The odd copies went for about $25.  The only sealed TG16 game that sells for less (on ebay) is Power Golf.  Red Frog is selling those games for $30 on TZD because he knows he can't charge anymore.

(In his defense, GDQ has recently raised their price to $49.)

Red Frog is also actively trolling ebay and adjusting his prices accordingly.  His price on Soldier Blade went from $59 to $79 overnight.  He also probably lurks in these forums, considering how quickly he fixed his "Sherlock Homes" ignorance after someone made fun of him.

i don't know where they got their stock from but i have a really good guess: i have been saying for a while that telegames.co.uk has the only real good stock of games left (outside of tzd). 

The stock might have come to them indirectly from Telegames U.S., but that's not where they purchased it.  Everyone has been selling the exact same slew of sealed games ever since a European ebay seller started liquidating a massive stock early last year.  I forget the seller's original name, it was either Direct4Games or something else that then changed to that, but their games were dirt cheap, mostly $1-2 (of course, they didn't combine shipping prices).  Some of the nicer titles included Military Madness, Splatterhouse, Darkwing Duck, and even more copies of CS2 and Exile.  Otherwise it was the stuff we're still swimming in on ebay, like Gunboat, Falcon and R-Type.  The two "rare" games were Ys 3 and Cotton, which were slightly more expensive.  Cotton was the most, going for $20.  Anyway, rumor has it their stock came from Telegames U.S.  Soon enough, other sellers like SimpleSamson and TZD cleaned them out and raised the prices.  If the TZD stock had actually come from Telegames UK, they would have copies of Bonk 3, Air Zonk, Samurai Ghost, Beyond Shadowgate (all of which were listed on their website last year) and tons of PCE games.

BTW, for those considering ordering from Telegames UK, let the buyer beware.  The two times I've attempted to order a US game that was actually a good deal, I've dealt with months of stalling and excuses before eventually getting my money refunded.  There was a post from another forum member on here who had the same experience last year.

[geepee16]

OK. as i've stated, i know nothing about redfrog and what their intentions are (well, i know more now after reading your posts) and i should make it clear that i understand the ebay price gouging that goes on and your feelings about it.  however, i feel compelled to make a few points here:

1. if redfrog - or anyone else - sees fit to price gouge, then let them. they will eventually tire of keeping those high prices and will eventually bring them down in the guise of a huge sale to save face. if someone pays those prices then it justifies rf's making them so high in the first place. if redfrog has pockets deep enough, he/she can keep those prices up there because someone will come around eventually and snatch that up.  if rf is smart, he'll buy up as many as possible and drain the market for a while and then wait because a smart business person knows that it's better to make a slow dime than a fast nickel. those words were spoken to me by steve at tzd when he was trying to rationalize telegames usa's sometimes silly prices.  that was what the owner of telegames told him and it generally works.


did i get ripped off by paying $30 each for sealed copies of exile and cf2? i don't feel i did because expecting to pay less than half the original $50 for a rare and good turbo game almost twenty years after its release is what lies just beyond wishful thinking, dreaming and insane. as i mentioned during the controversy over steve's final tzd sale, one of the problems is that we have been spoiled for many years.  we've had lords of thunder and forgotten worlds available to us for 13 years at $30.00 when others were selling them sealed for $50 or $80. the game was originally $50 and i will bet you anything that in five years we will start seing sealed copies of those games going up again. 

is $800 too much for dynastic hero? let's think about it. i have lost track over the years of how many sapphires, dracula xs, zenkis, chip chan kicks et al i have picked up for people.  (Listers out there would back this up).  in my experience, people have been willing to pay the actual fair price of, say, sapphire which has consistently been between $280-$330 over the last ten years.  if one is willling to pay $300 for a game with a run of 5,000 copies, wouldn't they also be willing at some point to pay $800 for a game with only 1,500 copies in circulation? of course, it's a little more complicated than that and at some point there has to be a line over which even the most adamant collector/gamer will not step.  i think $800 for dynastic hero is pushing that threshhold. not even darius alpha has gone that far. in fact, the only game for the pce/turbo to really go that far and much further was indo no honou which i have seen going for $4,000.

i hate to say it but the turbo and many other things like it is no longer just a piece of entertainment (a damned good one too!) but an investment.  a lot of time goes into even finding that stuff anymore to say nothing of the money that goes into buying it.  and the truth is that there are people out there willing to pay.  it sucks for us gamers and i am almost at the point of just translating the jp vesion of dynastic hero and getting someone to patch it in over the japanese text so that people can buy the much cheapr jp version and still enjoy it in english. that would satisfy those who want to play the game only.  anyway, i am too busy for that now but we'll see what life is like after miraculum is done. anyway...

as for stocks of games coming from telegames usa, i think it is highly unlikely.  they lost tons of stuff after the tornado that ravaged their warehouse. i am almost certain it was telegames uk who suddenly started posting deals on their website about a year or so ago.  interstingly, when i contacted them in december about these games:
Exile
Exile II: Wicked Phenomenon
Vasteel
Cotton
Godzilla
Forgotten Worlds

   they replied on december 12th saying they had only two copies left each of cotton and forgotten worlds (still have the email).  they used to have a lot more though.  it is interesting that years of unsold stock would start to move in 2007. in any case, i have dealt with them once before and
while their prices suck and their inventory list is HORRIBLY inaccurate.  they no longer have everything listed on their website.  some of the titles still listed sold out ages and ages ago. however, they delivered.

and sinistro said the following:
>   "...only difference is that they're the worst kind of EBay seller..." 

the worst kind of ebay seller? is redfrog worse than that european guy who was selling fake copies of sapphire? or that french guy Adol who was not only ripping people off but selling things that were not as promised? (wonder if he's still on ebay)

>  "...on EBay itself before any true fan can get to 'em..."

the true fan, imo, wants to play the games and might happily settle for used copies. redfrog is not the only source of turbo games out there and the true fan has had a long time to get many of these games at better prices.   and my advice to the true fan is this: get your hands on what you can now because people like redfrog are only getting more and more brazen in their pricing.  if you need an alternative to buying from ebay and telegames, try these boards and the tml.  there are lots of good traders out there but be warned, if you're looking for a sealed dracula x you are probably going to be charged for a sealed dracula x and what someone feels it should go for in 2008.

>  "...and then resells them for at least double the price."

wouldn't you do the same if you were out to make money? if i gave you ten boxed pce lt units in mint condition at $600 (they go in japan for about $800-$900 now), and you knew there were people out there who couldn't get to japan but were desperate to have one and were willing to pay $1500, wouldn't you try to increase your profit margin? 

>  "...The kind that now inexplicably sells XBox stuff and other non Turbo crap on its "TZD" page.  "

i don't like seeing non-turbo stuff on there either but this was bound to happen.  you know, after the neo geo pocket color went down, tzd almost bought up a large portion of snk's stock so this almost happened anyway.

>  "...And Dynastic Hero US is rare- but not THAT rare and not THAT expensive.  They know it, the informed here know it- you would do yourself good to know it as well."
 
i am hardly new to the scene. look. today on ebay, you can find zenki fx for $386.00. in 2000, it was going for $120-$140 and that was considered by far the most expensive fx game.  should it be that much? ask the bidders on there. it's not about what the game is worth, it's about what people are willing to pay. it sucks. it's not right to charge that.  it's a shame that a retailer like tzd has to suffer a downgrade by becoming essentially a storefront for an ebay seller but any purchase we make from them justifies their existence.