So whats the deal with the arcade card?

[SignOfZeta]

A division of a company can't go bankrupt, only separate companies. They can be killed off or whatever, but bankruptcy is something that effects the entire company. What division are you talking about exactly?

There were dozens of games released after 1994 and almost none of them are Arcade Card requisite. This is because developers wanted to make any PCE game they released to have maximum compatibility with the existing userbase, and with poor ACD sales it made the most sense to release games as SCDs.

[BigusSchmuck]

If only NEC spent more time with the Arcade Card vs PC-FX things may have turned out different. Or better yet have a upgrade that made your PC engine into a PC-FX. Could have been interesting...

[nat]

Curious, I know it was made for Neo Geo ports and the ever so awesome Sapphire, but whats the story behind it? Why did NEC make so few games for it and what made them stop developing more games like Sapphire? Yeah I know they had another system (PC-FX), but come on, this thing could have easily competed with the likes of the next gen consoles at the time! Makes one wonder...

The division of NEC that sold the Duo basically went bankrupt shortly after the Arcade card was released. That is why there were no more games for it. End of story.

No doubt. With all the money they pumped into the KOF '95 port and Sapphire's real-time 3D engine, how could they make a profit?

Seriously, this is not a true statement.

I didn't say NEC went bankrupt, I said a small DIVISION of NEC (NEC Avenue). The Duo really was discontinued in 1994. Most of those games came out...

Where are you getting this information? Someone has sadly led you up the garden path.

NEC Avenue was not responsible for the Duo. NEC Avenue was an in-house software dev team that mostly handled arcade ports. NEC Avenue never went bankrupt, they were expanded into (or dissolved, and then integrated into, depending on who you believe) NEC Interchannel.

Either way, the NEC Avenue->NEC Interchannel mutation didn't happen until 1996 so I'm not really sure what your point is, assuming they had anything directly to do with Duo sales (which they didn't).

They pulled the plug on the console division because it was no longer as profitable as their other divisions.

This is just reality.

This isn't reality, and it doesn't even make any sense. How could NEC's console division have been discontinued in 1994 just as they were launching a brand new 32-bit platform? NEC's console division soldiered on with the PC-FX at the helm until 1998, when the plug was finally pulled.

Still, NEC Interchannel lived on despite console production ceasing. As a matter of fact, Interchannel still exists today despite the controlling interests having been sold off to a third party in 2004.

[Supremo_Lagarto]

Someone has sadly led you up the garden path.

Hey, let's be nice.

There were no more Arcade card games after 1995 because there were no longer Duo's being produced as of 1994.

The division that produced the Duo console was dissolved in 1994 or early 1995. The Duo consoles themselves were not produced after 1994 (1993 in the states).

NEC Avenue was a subdivision of NEC (which designed and produced the DUO with Hudson), so naturally they were involved in the sale of DUO-related products, to suggest they were not is silly. My six button gamepad has NEC Avenue written right on it. It is not a software arcade port. It is a piece of hardware.

The NEC Avenue brand was retired in the mid 90's (because they didn't make enough money for NEC). Just like with any corporate subdivision, the personnel and resources were allocated somewhere else. The NEC Avenue brand was retired. Whether or not we consider NEC Interchannel to be the same subdivision is splitting semantic hairs and missing the point completely.

The PCFX 32-bit platform was not a console in the traditional sense; it was more of an attempt to create a multimedia center or computer. It didn't really fit into either category.

My whole point was that NO DUOS after 1994 = NO MORE ARCADE CARD GAMES.

I like like a company and its products and wish things had been different, but I can't change history to support my bias.

If only NEC spent more time with the Arcade Card vs PC-FX things may have turned out different. Or better yet have a upgrade that made your PC engine into a PC-FX. Could have been interesting...

The Arcade Card was still limited by the capabilities of the Duo, which was at heart an 8-bit system. The biggest problem with the PCFX is that they eliminated features that would have made it competitive with Sony and Sega, but did not redesign it to then be more affordable than what Sony and Sega were producing at the time. They also couldn't seem to decide what the PCFX was supposed to be or who their market was.

[nat]

There were no more Arcade card games after 1995 because there were no longer Duo's being produced as of 1994.

The division that produced the Duo console was dissolved in 1994 or early 1995. The Duo consoles themselves were not produced after 1994 (1993 in the states).

You might be right that there were no Duos produced after 1994 (I don't have any information either way), but there were certainly arcade card games produced into 1996, so I'm not really sure what you're getting after.

NEC Avenue was a subdivision of NEC (which designed and produced the DUO with Hudson), so naturally they were involved in the sale of DUO-related products, to suggest they were not is silly.

What's silly is claiming that NEC Avenue, a software development team, was responsible for marketing the Duo because the parent company is NEC Home Electronics.

NEC Home Electronics <> NEC Avenue.

It's like saying that Hudson Soft is responsible for marketing the latest Castlevania titles because they are part of Konami.

My six button gamepad has NEC Avenue written right on it. It is not a software arcade port. It is a piece of hardware.

Your 6 button pad doesn't have "NEC Avenue" written on it, it has "Avenue Pad 6" written on it.

The NEC Avenue brand was retired in the mid 90's (because they didn't make enough money for NEC). Just like with any corporate subdivision, the personnel and resources were allocated somewhere else. It didn't mutate into another subdivision, it was retired. Whether or not we consider NEC Interchannel to be the same subdivision is splitting semantic hairs and missing the point completely.

Yes, what is your point? You've stated NEC Avenue was responsible for marketing the Duo, and that they went "bankrupt" in 1994 thus ceasing production of the Duo and arcade card games alike.

However, NEC Avenue continued operations under the NEC Avenue name until 1996, so at least part of your statement certainly isn't accurate.

You then stated no arcade card games were produced after 1994, when in fact they were still being produced into 1996.

I don't even know what we're arguing here, other than the fact that you're clearly misinformed.

And then this....

The PCFX 32-bit platform was not a console in the traditional sense; it was more of a computer or media center.

...is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever read.

Just because we like a company and its products does not mean we get to invent the truth to support our bias.

You are the only one inventing "truth" here, unfortunately.

[Supremo_Lagarto]

My point was that the reason there were no (or very few) Arcade Card games being released, was that the Duo stopped production in 1994.

You might be right that there were no Duos produced after 1994 (I don't have any information either way), but there were certainly arcade card games produced into 1996, so I'm not really sure what you're getting after.

The fact that a handful of obscure titles slipped out past 1994 does not change the fact that software companies were not interested in developing games for a defunct platform. I'm sure we all understand this.

What's silly is claiming that NEC Avenue, a software development team, was responsible for marketing the Duo because the parent company is NEC Home Electronics.

Anyone who thinks I claimed this has misunderstood me. "Bankrupt" was the wrong term for me to use as it implies insolvency and a subdivision cannot be fiscally insolvent. I should have simply said they were not making enough money, so the brand was retired and the resources and personnel were used elsewhere.

Your 6 button pad doesn't have "NEC Avenue" written on it, it has "Avenue Pad 6" written on it.

Actually it has the NEC Avenue brand logo on it, because they produced and marketed it. It is also on the box. This is not difficult to verify. However, it does also say Avenue Pad 6.

Yes, what is your point? You've stated NEC Avenue was responsible for marketing the Duo, and that they went "bankrupt" in 1994 thus ceasing production of the Duo and arcade card games alike.

I never said they marketed the Duo. I said they marketed a lot of the later products. When the Duo was no longer being produced, NEC Avenue was functionally dissolved or reorganized into a completely different subdivision. After that point there was little to no more support for Arcade Card Products.

...is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever read.

You are the only one inventing "truth" here, unfortunately.

When one engages in a civil discussion, one usually avoids statements of this nature as they are unnecessary.

[Edmond Dantes]

I like like a company and its products and wish things had been different, but I can't change history to support my bias.

Sure we can!  The Engine never died!  NEC lives on!  The only reason we haven't seen any new games since then is because of a terrorist plot!  That's it, all the new Duo games are locked up in a secret underground base somewhere, and we have to rescue them!

The Playstation is a lie!

[SignOfZeta]

My point was that the reason there were no (or very few) Arcade Card games being released, was that the Duo stopped production in 1994.

As I said before there were dozens of PCE games released after 1994. Many of them were published by NEC themselves.

Bazaaru de Gozaaru no Geemu de Gozaaru, 1996
Dead of the Brain 1 & 2, 1999
Tekipaki Wakin - Love, 1997
Madou Monogatari, 1996
De Ja, 1996
Go! Go! Birdie Chance, 1996
Puyo Puyo CD 2, 1996
Doukyūsei, 1995
Linda 3, 1995
Private Eye Doll, 1995

There are more.

My point is that the Arcade Card fell out of popularity all on its own. It had zero to do with the PC Engine reaching EOL. Also, NEC Avenue/Interchannel/Home Electronics weren't needed to make an Arcade Card game anyway. See: Sapphire, 1995. Of the 60 or so games released after 1994, almost none of them are ACDs. They could have been, but they aren't. The reason for this is that most people wouldn't have been able to appreciate it, and the sales would have suffered. It has nothing to do with NEC. The SCD format was simply the most popular. Its the same reason Bomberman '94 and Bonk 3 were standard HuCards instead of Supergrafx HuCards. The PC Engine has more than one evolutionary dead end. (Part of the charm, IMO)

So your basic statement, that ACD games stopped coming because some specific group within NEC was dissolved or that production of new PCE consoles had ended is immaterial. Its not uncommon at all to continued to make games after a system goes out of production. Sega did it with the DC (Puyo Puyo 4, Sakura Wars 4) Nintendo did it with the FC (those crazy cart releases of FD games in the 90s) SNK did with the Neo Geo big time. I'm not sure how many years the AES was out of production when Samshow V Special was released. NEC did it with the Duo, see: Dead of the Brain, 1999, 5 years after (according to you) Duo production had stopped.

[Necromancer]

NEC Avenue and NEC Interchannel were unrelated and the PC-FX wasn't a console?!?  Man, where do these people come from? 

[BigusSchmuck]

NEC Avenue and NEC Interchannel were unrelated and the PC-FX wasn't a console?!?  Man, where do these people come from?

From the depths of their nerd caves, thats where (mine so happens to be the phone room at work). ^^ Joking aside...

The Arcade Card was still limited by the capabilities of the Duo, which was at heart an 8-bit system. 

That didn't stop the Playdia, it too was a 8 bit system. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Playdia

[nodtveidt]

Are we still on the bit war bullshit? That crap's been debunked to the point of ad nauseum ages ago.

[BigusSchmuck]

Are we still on the bit war bullshit? That crap's been debunked to the point of ad nauseum ages ago.

Hence my Playdia reference. It is a tired argument, just like the SNES vs Genesis arguments back in the day.

[SignOfZeta]

Why would anyone mention the Playdia as a pro-8-bit factoid? The thing was a collossal flop.

[rag-time4]

I dunno about World Heroes, but I'm able to compare Fatal Fury 2 to the version on the Playstation 2's Battle Archives release.

The only difference so far is that the shadows flicker and there are load times.  Oh, and you have to play with a PC Engine controller.  That's it.  It seems to be a solid port.

There is one major difference between the pce ACD port of fatal fury 2 and the neo geo version that i would like to point out to my Irem-loving friend, which is the redbook audio of the ACD version. To my fanboy ears, the music of teh ACD fatal fury 2 is heaven! Even ACD fatal fury special is a step down! The only tune i like better in the original neo geo version is joe higashi's stage.

[Edmond Dantes]

If I may revive this topic real quick, I always wondered something:

Why are there two versions of the Arcade Card?  Is there even really a difference?  Would anything bad happen if I tried to plug the Duo model into a briefcase?