Saving games on PCE systems

[Frank_fjs]

True, but supercaps are far more reliable.

[Necromancer]

That is basically the same thing. They both run out of charge after a while and you lose your saves.

What's the big deal?  When I was in college, my poor Duo stayed at home and would go months without use, yet nary a save file was lost.  If you're really worried, get a Tennokoe Bank or two for a little extra protection.

[city41]

20 years ago that was probably the best tech available. At least it doesn't require a physical battery change.

[kamiboy]

I really like to keep my save games permanently. I guess I feel after I am done with a game that is the only record of me having completed it. With a PSX/PS2/NGC memory card you can drop them on there and they will last pretty much for as long as you want them to. Older systems are a mixed bag. Especially SNES games whose battery backups should me mostly on their death beds right about now.

For PS2 you can even buy one of those PS3 memory card transfer USB cables and backup your saves, which I wish I had done because my memory cards got stolen a few years ago along with half my games. I was just as upset about the games I lost as I was about those saves.

Well, at least most PCE action games are designed for one session clearance. In that cast I usually just take a picture of the ending screen.

[SignOfZeta]

I used to get all hung up about my game saves. Now I realize that if I haven't played the game in a decade or so then when I do come back to it I'm probably going to want to start from the begining.

Also, I way prefer the supercap systems to flash or batteries. I've never replaced then caps on either of my PCE systems, but I've gone through half a dozen batteries in my Saturns. Also, on PCE you don't have to do that Playstation bullshit where it says, "Which memory card? Preparing to save. Saving. Saved!". You just hit "save" and it makes a quick chiming sound or whatever and you are done. 

Seriously, why does saving take...any time at all...on modern systems? The Saturn and PCE and most computer games would save behind the scenes without you even knowing it half the time. Then the PS1 came along and now saving is this big deal where you have to click through 3 or 4 menus.

It's like the load times. The Neo CD is famous for, some would say defined by, it's long load times, but the PS1 somehow isn't. The load times on Street Fighter Zero for PS1 are INSANE.

[kamiboy]

Neo CD load times prolly had to do with the fact that those games were mostly designed around being loaded off of carts, then were later "ported" to be loaded of off CD's. It would have been a lot of work to reprogram the games to load efficiently off of CD's and in some cases I suppose the way the game was designed just made it nigh possible to do right.

PlayStation had the luxury of being designed solely around CD's so the games were designed from outset to load efficiently off of them.

[city41]

Neo CD load times prolly had to do with the fact that those games were mostly designed around being loaded off of carts, then were later "ported" to be loaded of off CD's. It would have been a lot of work to reprogram the games to load efficiently off of CD's and in some cases I suppose the way the game was designed just made it nigh possible to do right.

Although it does look like SNK made the extra effort for Real Bout 2. Real Bout Special on the Neo CD has absolutely insane load times (the worst of any fighter ever I do believe), yet its sequel has almost no load times and is loading just about the same amount of content.

Anyway, I do think comparing the 1987 PC Engine to the 2000 PS2 is a little unfair

[vestcoat]

That is basically the same thing. They both run out of charge after a while and you lose your saves.

Between super capacitors and Tennokoe banks, the PCE has the best of both worlds when it comes to protecting save files. I keep a TG w/Turbobooster Plus, a Duo, and a SGX w/SCD hooked up in my living room. If I don't play one for a month, I just turn it on for a minute - capacitor charged. We never have to buy replacement batteries and no one's system has ever been destroyed by dead batteries.

For extra storage and really important files, we have Tennokoe banks. They hold 4x as much as a Duo, they cost $8 (only slightly more than a single button battery at Radio Shack), and their batteries are lasting longer than some of the ones in my SNES carts.

We're also lucky that half of our games (hucards) feature passwords. A hassle for everyday use, passwords are good for freeing up system space after beating a game and protecting long-term accomplishments. I still have my Order of the Griffon and Ys passwords for right before the last battles.

The Duo save system does have flaws - I've lost files by forgetting to turn my system on AND being too lazy to mirror a bank onto a Tennokoe card for six months. It's a responsibility vs. reliability trade off. IMO, a little mindfulness and elbow grease is worth not having to screw around with batteries.

[SignOfZeta]

Neo CD load times prolly had to do with the fact that those games were mostly designed around being loaded off of carts, then were later "ported" to be loaded of off CD's. It would have been a lot of work to reprogram the games to load efficiently off of CD's and in some cases I suppose the way the game was designed just made it nigh possible to do right.

PlayStation had the luxury of being designed solely around CD's so the games were designed from outset to load efficiently off of them.

You're missing the point. I'm not complaining about the Neo CD. I'm complaining about the PS1.

People actually used to complain about load times on PCE. Can you even imagine that now? Aside from a few Arcade Card games PCE stuff usually loads in 3-5 seconds. Somehow the PS1 just...altered everyone's standards to the point where they were way way more patient.

It takes longer to load a save file for many PS1 games than it does to load the title screen on a PCE game.

[kamiboy]

Save game loading is a none issue in my opinion, you do it once at the start of the game. Saving you do maybe 1-3 times a gaming session. Loading happens much more frequently thus is something to be bothered about.

I do not remember the PS1 starting the whole slow loading trend though, were SEGA CD games and other early CD systems really that much better?

If they were it had to do the amount of data involved being smaller for 16 bit sprite graphics than for 32bit 3D titles.

[city41]

People actually used to complain about load times on PCE. Can you even imagine that now?

This time around coming back to the PCE, I ended up getting a TG16 CD add on. The 1x of this drive versus the 2x of the Duo didn't even phase me. Load times are completely irrelevant as far as I'm concerned.

[SignOfZeta]

Save game loading is a none issue in my opinion, you do it once at the start of the game. Saving you do maybe 1-3 times a gaming session. Loading happens much more frequently thus is something to be bothered about.

I do not remember the PS1 starting the whole slow loading trend though, were SEGA CD games and other early CD systems really that much better?

Yes. Absolutely yes. The PCE has, on average, a fraction of the loading the PS1 has.

People actually used to complain about load times on PCE. Can you even imagine that now?

This time around coming back to the PCE, I ended up getting a TG16 CD add on. The 1x of this drive versus the 2x of the Duo didn't even phase me. Load times are completely irrelevant as far as I'm concerned.

Yeah, I'm not sure who told you that but all PCE systems have the same speed drive, 1x.

There is, supposedly, faster loading on Super CD games when played on a system that has the Super System built into it, but I've never noticed it.

[Digi.k]

The Memory Base 128 is its own stupid thing entirely.

sigh* tell me about it.. I bought one about 3 years ago and still haven't found a use for it cept it just looks cool..

[vestcoat]

Yeah, I'm not sure who told you that but all PCE systems have the same speed drive, 1x.

There is, supposedly, faster loading on Super CD games when played on a system that has the Super System built into it, but I've never noticed it.

Maybe it has something to do with the the lens mechanism. Keith Courage said that his new two-gear system speeds up the TGCD significantly.

The Memory Base 128 is its own stupid thing entirely.

sigh* tell me about it.. I bought one about 3 years ago and still haven't found a use for it cept it just looks cool..

I like to plug it in once in a while, then throw on a Duo Tap, a 6-button controller, and an Arcade Card and sit back and watch Vasteel 2 detect them all - awesome.

[grahf]

It would be awesome if someone would create a utility program to copy save files back and forth between the system save and Memory Base. That way it could be left plugged in and used as a sort of "Super Tennokoe Bank".  128k could back up a whole lot of files.  What do you say, Chris Covell? Care to update your bram tool?