Author Topic: More and more people refuse international customers. Why is that?  (Read 1348 times)

grimm

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 175
Hello. Ive been bidding on items on ebay for the past 10 years soon. Ive noticed a steady increase on people who refuse international customers, in USA, and im wondering what the motivations really are? I feel it has more to do with laziness than anything else.

Im aware that certain countries have more problems with customs, either delays, theft or odd restrictions to make people unwilling to ship to certain places. Italy seems the main issue for many who sell internationally otherwise. But ive come across a growing number of both professional sellers on ebay in particular, but also private persons selling, who is now refusing to sell outside USA.

When i DO get a response, asking them to please reconsider shipping abroad, providing reasurancses and what not, some do reconsider, and the deal always comes through fine, but some will only say "no". I then proceed to ask in a polite way why they do not wish to sell to me. I usually dont get responses to that, or they say "too much hassle, lost items" etc.. I dont understand the problem. A customs slip does not take that long to fill in, lost items can be insured against, like telling international customers they ONLY provide insured shipping abroad. Then its much less of a problem right there. I mean, if they would sell internationally, they could even potentially get more for their items.

Sellers on ebay.co.uk and ebay.de usually have no problem selling internationally even if they dont state it in the auction, just ask them prior to bidding and they say yes and qoute shipping if you asked for that. Sometimes shipping is too high, but at least they are willing. Often USA sellers say "shipping will be too expensive, so i dont ship outside USA". How is that their problem? I mean its the buyer who pays for it, let THEM decide if its too expensive etc..

This might come across as a rant, but im sincerely curious to hear what you guys might have to say about it. Either as USA sellers on ebay, forums or what not, or buyers from outside the USA, who has experienced the same, or simply disagree with me.. Let me hear what you guys have to say!

Ive lost the chance on bidding or buying hard to find items for fairly good prices, simply because im located in Sweden. And that is starting to annoy me... since this wasnt the case just a few years ago!

storino03

  • Guest
Re: More and more people refuse international customers. Why is that?
« Reply #1 on: June 03, 2012, 09:06:00 AM »
It's more of a hassle, when problems arise due to packages being lost or sent back due to a wrong/incorrect address (wasting time), customs fraud (people refuse to pay the tax fee or whatever it is, or ask you to disguise the item as something else), wariness of shipping costs for some, and just that people don't want to. Simple as that.

It all comes down to people being ignorant to the ways of international shipping more than anything else. Unfortunate though.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2012, 09:07:43 AM by storino03 »

Bernie

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4271
    • Facebook URL
Re: More and more people refuse international customers. Why is that?
« Reply #2 on: June 03, 2012, 09:07:28 AM »
Yeah, it has become a hassle.  Tho I still will ship overseas, but its a bitch. 

Ji-L87

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 726
Re: More and more people refuse international customers. Why is that?
« Reply #3 on: June 03, 2012, 09:27:57 AM »
I haven't had so much trouble with people from the US as I've had trouble with people from UK not wanting to ship to Sweden. Then again, I rarely buy things from the US because of shipping and customs. I won some sweet raffles when I first joined (Sapphire bootleg and Gate of Thunder) and sadly they seem to have gotten lost somewhere. :(
So, grimm, I know your pain. Visst suger det :(
« Last Edit: June 03, 2012, 09:56:31 AM by Ji-L87 »
CHECKPOINT!
There is a perverted Japanese businessman in every Swiss PCE fan.

420GOAT

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 838
Re: More and more people refuse international customers. Why is that?
« Reply #4 on: June 03, 2012, 09:45:55 AM »
in short , no one has to sell to you if they dont want to. international is a problem as far as paperwork, and i ship all over the world where i work and there is a higher percentage of incidents. customs, freight costs, damages, if some one is not in accordance with descriptions or conditions, who foots the bill? it can be a problem.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2012, 09:48:01 AM by 420GOAT »
I want to be more like 337.

The Wolf: If I'm curt with you it's because time is a factor. I think fast, I talk fast and I need you guys to act fast if you wanna get out of this. So, pretty please... with sugar on top. Clean the f*cking car.

ProfessorProfessorson

  • Guest
Re: More and more people refuse international customers. Why is that?
« Reply #5 on: June 03, 2012, 10:53:09 AM »
Unless it is someone I know personally, I wont do it anymore myself. I stopped years ago after I sold off my arcade stuff. Most often after a international bidder would win they would demand I ship the item via a untrackable/uninsurable method, and mark gift, none of which I will do due to fraud/loss/damage etc. After refusing to do so they simply would not pay. I have had similar issues on Digital Press over this, with people from South America messaging me about a prior sales thread of mine, and making demands that I sell this and this and this, and ship via this method only, blah blah blah.

In the end I just said f*ck it, if I don't know you, I'm not selling to you if you are outside of the USA. People I don't even know are not doing me any favors here by winning my auctions then giving me hassles and grief. Honestly I don't need the business, as I have plenty of buyers as is domestically that I don't need to blindly sell internationally to whomever. It's too risky and too much a hassle and waste of my time anymore. People often forget there is a such thing as a bad buyer, and most of the time, in my experience, they have been located outside the US. Sucks and all, but true none the less.

Bernie

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4271
    • Facebook URL
Re: More and more people refuse international customers. Why is that?
« Reply #6 on: June 03, 2012, 11:08:21 AM »
Unless it is someone I know personally, I wont do it anymore myself. I stopped years ago after I sold off my arcade stuff. Most often after a international bidder would win they would demand I ship the item via a untrackable/uninsurable method, and mark gift, none of which I will do due to fraud/loss/damage etc. After refusing to do so they simply would not pay. I have had similar issues on Digital Press over this, with people from South America messaging me about a prior sales thread of mine, and making demands that I sell this and this and this, and ship via this method only, blah blah blah.

In the end I just said f*ck it, if I don't know you, I'm not selling to you if you are outside of the USA. People I don't even know are not doing me any favors here by winning my auctions then giving me hassles and grief. Honestly I don't need the business, as I have plenty of buyers as is domestically that I don't need to blindly sell internationally to whomever. It's too risky and too much a hassle and waste of my time anymore. People often forget there is a such thing as a bad buyer, and most of the time, in my experience, they have been located outside the US. Sucks and all, but true none the less.

You said everything I wanted to say but couldnt get it out my head. 

grimm

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 175
Re: More and more people refuse international customers. Why is that?
« Reply #7 on: June 03, 2012, 11:16:08 AM »
Most of your reasons for it being a hassle can be avoided by simply stating conditions prior to the sale. It isnt a valid reason to refuse these buyers simply saying its just a "hassle", no to me... I have never once had a hassle and ive done over 400 imports of various items, mostly from ebay. Now sure, you dont have to sell to everyone, no one can force you to do that. But at the same time, the reasons given are pretty much laziness about stipulating conditions than actually filling in custom forms or dealing with an issue when something occasionally goes wrong. That and a degree of prejudice.

Demand insured shipping used in the sales condition and most of your so called hassle would be out of the way. It would be the buyer and the freight company's problem then. If people dont accept those conditions, you have all the right in the world to not sell to them, and i would be on your side then. Its that simple.

Ive shipped stuff abroad myself, never once had an issue. And the extra few moments at the post office to fill in the extra information isnt really a hassle to me, it takes like 5 minutes.

Also, there is no extra significant cost for you to ship abroad. the buyer pays all the extra shipping, the insurance and if you get buyers asking you to falsify customs forms just say you wont do it and that problem is out of the world too. Ive asked for things marked as gift now and then, but i always respect if a person is unwilling to do so. I also understand that insured shipping is often costly, and i also understand the risks if i go for uninsured.

Some of you have given some depth to your reasons to deny international buyers, but i was hoping for more rational reasons than "hassle". So keep it coming!

Btw, im not trying to be offensive, so please dont take my talk of laziness as personal attacks. im lazy sometimes too!
« Last Edit: June 03, 2012, 11:19:49 AM by grimm »

grimm

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 175
Re: More and more people refuse international customers. Why is that?
« Reply #8 on: June 03, 2012, 11:23:06 AM »
I haven't had so much trouble with people from the US as I've had trouble with people from UK not wanting to ship to Sweden. Then again, I rarely buy things from the US because of shipping and customs. I won some sweet raffles when I first joined (Sapphire bootleg and Gate of Thunder) and sadly they seem to have gotten lost somewhere. :(
So, grimm, I know your pain. Visst suger det :(

Then you must be pretty well off, or really focused on game purchases compared to other expenses.. Even with import related costs i never pay prices asked in sweden, or most of europe, as opposed to US and Japan. Its always a savings even with all costs added in.

storino03

  • Guest
Re: More and more people refuse international customers. Why is that?
« Reply #9 on: June 03, 2012, 11:54:19 AM »
One time I had to ship a controller to Brazil. Purchase price was $20, shipping was $11 (to get insured shipping, it would be an additional $11). I have a problem with shipping when tracked packages cost just as much (and then some) as the actual value.

It also doesn't matter if the person paid an additional $22 in shipping. Just seems counter-productive. I also don't get what you mean by filling out customs forms and people being lazy. I don't mind filling them out. I was simply saying, the buyers often ask to mark this or that, as something different than what the actual item is.

In the end, albeit ignorance or plain refusal to ship/sell internationally, I don't think I'm being given second thoughts because of what others may think.

grimm

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 175
Re: More and more people refuse international customers. Why is that?
« Reply #10 on: June 03, 2012, 12:04:23 PM »
Again, i ment no offense to anyone with the lazy comment, but i HAVE had that reply a few times. "i dont want to fill in the extra paperwork".. I dont see what other than laziness would motivate that response..

As for paying more in shipping for the item than the item itself, yes it sucks, but it would be more fair for the buyer to make that decision for himself. Maybe its the ONLY way he can get the item to begin with, so he is willing to do so. As for falsifying custom forms, simply inform the buyer when he asks, that you will not do so.

I dont understand what you mean by "second thoughts". Please explain if you will.

ProfessorProfessorson

  • Guest
Re: More and more people refuse international customers. Why is that?
« Reply #11 on: June 03, 2012, 12:21:40 PM »
Most of your reasons for it being a hassle can be avoided by simply stating conditions prior to the sale. It isnt a valid reason to refuse these buyers simply saying its just a "hassle", no to me... I have never once had a hassle and ive done over 400 imports of various items, mostly from ebay. Now sure, you don't have to sell to everyone, no one can force you to do that. But at the same time, the reasons given are pretty much laziness about stipulating conditions than actually filling in custom forms or dealing with an issue when something occasionally goes wrong. That and a degree of prejudice.

Demand insured shipping used in the sales condition and most of your so called hassle would be out of the way. It would be the buyer and the freight company's problem then. If people dont accept those conditions, you have all the right in the world to not sell to them, and i would be on your side then. Its that simple.

Ive shipped stuff abroad myself, never once had an issue. And the extra few moments at the post office to fill in the extra information isnt really a hassle to me, it takes like 5 minutes.

Also, there is no extra significant cost for you to ship abroad. the buyer pays all the extra shipping, the insurance and if you get buyers asking you to falsify customs forms just say you wont do it and that problem is out of the world too. Ive asked for things marked as gift now and then, but i always respect if a person is unwilling to do so. I also understand that insured shipping is often costly, and i also understand the risks if i go for uninsured.

Some of you have given some depth to your reasons to deny international buyers, but i was hoping for more rational reasons than "hassle". So keep it coming!

Btw, im not trying to be offensive, so please dont take my talk of laziness as personal attacks. im lazy sometimes too!

When you flat out state what methods you ship by, what you are willing to do and what you wont do, more often then not this was simply ignored by international bidders in my case anyway. I always have a shipping and payment policy listed on my auctions and sales threads. Sadly people want what they want, and they don't care about what they consider to be small details or if they are going to be wasting your time when they decide they don't agree with your payment and shipping policies after the fact. When people flat out ignore your policies, refuse to purchase anything but slow uninsurable shipping, don't pay, force me to open a non-paying bidder claim, relist items, etc, then yeah, its a f*cking hassle and waste of my time.

Who the f*ck are you to accuse people of being lazy, prejudice, or to judge how valuable their time and energy is to them? Have you ever lived in the USA? Have you ever filled out a USPS customs form multiple times. Have you had to spend hundreds of hours at a USPS office? Do you sell more then 1-5 items a month, every month? Do you deal with more then 4-5 customers a month, including all correspondence back and forth related to said sales? Until you do all the above, you don't have room to say shit.

You're coming off like the dickhead living on the other side of the world with no idea how it is on the other side, all naive assumptions and bullshit about other people and their situations, thinking its all cut and dry. Not one f*cking clue how things even work on their side of the world. You don't even know the first thing about them or what they have had to deal with prior, let alone knowing how each of their lives are as is as a individual, but there you sit, all judgmental because you cant get the things you want.

My local USPS stays busy, with long lines most of the day. I don't care to finally get to the clerk, then hold up this line while I deal with a international package when I can pre-pay for everything shipping wise at home and drop them off at the package area and avoid the lines and clerks. And yeah, I don't like filling out customs forms. IT IS A WASTE OF MY TIME when I can sell the exact same item to someone locally for the same amount, and not have to fill out said form or deal with the bullshit at the post office. For me time is money. All my reasons I have listed are legitimate. Hassles being everything I just spoke of, waste my time and damage my handling of over all sales.

No one wants to ship to you anymore, tough shit then. People don't ship internationally anymore, like me, then I'm sure they have their reasons. Its not your place, business, or right even, to question as to why. You seem less concerned anyway with knowing why, and more interested in trying to debate it and inform everyone why in your opinion they are wrong, and no one here cares for that. And if you think its just people in the USA who wont ship internationally, then go hop on over to Yahoo Japan Auctions and see how many people will sell to you without you using a proxy service, or sign up on LDDB, and contact sellers in the UK and elsewhere, and tell them you are located in the USA or elsewhere, and see how many will be willing to sell to you. Odds are you wont find many unless they are a normal shop with some kind of employees working for them, because no matter where in the world, no individual seller wants to deal with any level of bullshit when it can easily be avoided. Just stick to the sellers who are still willing to deal with the bullshit and thank your lucky f*cking stars there are still some willing to do so.


storino03

  • Guest
Re: More and more people refuse international customers. Why is that?
« Reply #12 on: June 03, 2012, 12:28:20 PM »
Well said, Prof. :)

grimm

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 175
Re: More and more people refuse international customers. Why is that?
« Reply #13 on: June 03, 2012, 12:32:47 PM »
There is no need for all that agression. I said i ment no offense with lazy. I was simply being objective and i also said im lazy too. So if thats an accusation to you, im just as guilty as im lazy too sometimes. Feel free to correct me, and disagree with me, but at least be civilized about it..

You are actually assuming and making the same accusations you claim i have, and in a very agressive manner. I have not done so, i stated clearly i wanted people to comment their disagreements as well. I dont need my head bit off by some disgruntled overly agressive american who cant read, or read stuff between the lines which actually isnt there.

Im not here to annoy you or anyone else, i was simply trying to get a discussion going. Aparently i failed horribly but i dont need to be punished this harsly in a very abusive way by you for it. You could simply have said all that in a much more civilized way. ESPECIALLY if you felt insulted by what i had to say. Now you are just as big a dickhead as you claim i am. You preach on how i cant judge anything about people in USA, yet you judge me, personally quite freely.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2012, 12:41:42 PM by grimm »

grimm

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 175
Re: More and more people refuse international customers. Why is that?
« Reply #14 on: June 03, 2012, 12:50:41 PM »
I will ask a moderator to remove this thread as it was never my intention to insult anyone. I was simply being blunt about my opinions, and i am aware of more things than ProfessorProfessorson gives me credit for. That said, this just isnt worth responses like his.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2012, 01:07:13 PM by grimm »