Modern LCD screens and PC Engine Duo-R, compatibility issues?

[SignOfZeta]

Yeah, the earliest wave of LCDs were total f*cking garbage, especially the affordable ones.

[thesteve]

replacing a $200 set that is good for 20 years with a $1500 set thats good for 2

[HercTNT]

That sounds remarkably like my inlaws plasma. cost a fortune, puts out tons of heat, has slow refresh, games look like ass. Its really big though and has nifty high def

[RegalSin]

Most people are extremely happy with LCD. They like  being able to relocate the set from one side of the room to the other without having to hire piano movers.

I just wanted to point out, that the forced us to buy the flatscreens, it was even on the news. They pretty much marketed digital, and convinced us to switch. Like with Paypal, when they updated, and forced us to sign something that affected our rights.

Think of it, as being in the invisible union ( unlike the army of the employed ), everybody is a member. We are united by the choices we make. Flatscreens was not one of them. If a person is unable to hold the responsibilities of handling heavy objects, they should not.

Like how the women out number us, and the Asians, are becoming popular ( not because of videogames, and comic books ), we as men, normal English speaking men are becoming a dying breed.

[thesteve]

the flat screens were not forced upon me, i still run more CRT then other, except for pc monitors

[HercTNT]

Try to read regal's posts in the voice of gary busey...........

[thesteve]

lol
he is mostly right, just not completely

[SignOfZeta]

I'm a big RegalSin fan, but I don't think he's right at all in this case. Stores stopped selling CRTs because nobody wanted them. My 80 year old grandmother who has ZERO interest in technology (no internet, corded phone; 15 year old car) was thrilled to have an LCD because of how much space it saved. Sony in particular was dragged into the flat panel scene kicking and screaming.

It's true that analog TV transmission has ended, but this was done to make room in the spectrum for the 5 billion cellular devices we'll eventually have. Also, my 2005 CRT does pick up digital TV so that has nothing to do with it.

These days the cost of a piece of electronics in the US is determined largely by how many will fit in a standard shipping container from China. CRTs take up 10x as much space and if both CRTs and flat panels were onthe market today the cost difference alone would make them extremely unpopular, as would convergence issues and their huge weight...the first thing in the owners manual for my 34", no joke, is a chapter on how to make sure your toddler doesn't die from tipping the TV on top of themselves.

[thesteve]

well zeta, there is another reason.
the NIMBY environmentalists did ban the production of new CRT's in america.
that alone makes the china thing our fault.
the digi sig was mandated for wireless device expansion (more $$$$ for selling bandwidth)
i run old CRT sets, but couldnt buy one if i wanted to new.
where RegalSin's argument fails is nobody forced anyone to get rid of their CRT sets.
they just changed the TV signals to something less than usefull on most.

[SignOfZeta]

When did production of CRTs in the US end, like 1982? Well before they ceased to be available. Well before large flat panel TVs were anything but scifi. I know eventually (maybe around the same time) Zenith became the only American company selling TVs, but they had all their production outside of the country anyway so I'm not sure that any effect on anything.

Also, there probably was a less destructive way to make CRTs that would work with US environmental laws, but rather than pursue it its a lot easier to just blame the government for putting you out of business. There are just as many "NIMBY" people in Japan as there are here and they were making CRTs in Japan by the boatload, quite profitably, until the mid 2000s.

How many video game consoles were being made in the US after the 2600? Any? Jag? How many good ones? None, for sure. The last home video machines to be made in the US were CED players, and that ended in 1984. No Laserdisc player was ever manufactured in the US even though the shit was invented here (before Pioneer owned the market, MCA contracted the production of players to Pioneer from the beginning) and the only American VCR company I can think of is GoVideo, and I'm not sure they actually built the things here either.

Yet somehow CRT production was killed by an overreaching environmental law? That seems pretty unlikely.

If you look on CL right now for the higher end CRTs, if they give any reason for getting rid of the set its almost always "its too f*cking big". Once people get used to flat panels that they could carry around on a bicycle the CRTs that require truck rental start to look...f*cking stupid, honestly. If they aren't into retro electronics they are just hauling around a giant fragile piece of glass with inferior picture for no reason. It makes sense to stay CRT for us wierdos, but its all negatives and no plusses for your average dude and that's why the stuff is gone.

[Keith Courage]

I have a friend with a generic Durabrand 32 inch LCD TV from walmart. Looks great when running a Turbo grafx through composite on it.  So it is basically hit or miss if a LCD or plasma will display composite well or not.

[HercTNT]

Keith, i agree. I run dos games on a 17" lcd and they look fine. On my 30" lcd they look like crap. Even then though, size of the lcd is not always the determining factor. Some just look way better than others.

Us laws do have a large part to do with it. I'm not gonna break out the bango for the long list of things affected, but here are a few:
batteries (must contain less than one percent of mercury)
lightbulbs (incandescent lightbulbs are to be phased out by 2016)
cars (must be 35mpg or higher by 2020)
anything that has to be ROHS compliant (all electronics, cannot have any lead, mercury, cadnium, chromate, etc..)
etc.........

[SignOfZeta]

Us laws do have a large part to do with it.

To do with what? What specific US laws killed CRT production in the US? You brought it up. Is there a point to this or are you just griping about the fact that environmental laws exist? Personally, I like not having lead in my drinking water and the ocean at my back door.

cars (must be 35mpg or higher by 2020)

Heh, no. Such a law would ban not only every Ferrari, but also America's best selling piece of shit, the F-150. The new EPA rules say that OEMs must raise their Corporate Average Fuel Economy, and for the first time they are including light trucks in the number, which they f*cking should because they are all anyone buys anymore. Currently its 30.2 for cars and 24.1 for light trucks. This is a average meaning that as long as Toyota sells a 45MPG Yaris for every 15MPG Sienna they meet the 30.2 with ease. Ford offsets the horrible fuel economy of an F-150 by selling a Focus. Ferrari offsets the wastage of a V12 supercar by selling a Fiat 500. There are also all sorts of other cheap tricks to get around the numbers, such as credits for biofuels and hybrid technologies, even if they don't do anything (in the case of GM's pathetic idle stop system in pickups years back, or the horrific load of bullshit that is E85).

Anyway, its 35.5 by 2016, 54.5 by 2025. While many people complain that is an impossible number, the same people said the same thing for the 1978 model year when the average requirement for cars was 18...which is worse than almost every car sold today with the exception of a few limos and supercars.

[HercTNT]

I have zero issue with environmental laws and made no statement as such. Your flying off the handle and just ranting to rant. Don't be so naive to assume that somebody made a law that says "you can't make crts anymore", or something to that effect. If your looking for an specific example, of course i can't give one. Also, i said the laws do have something to do with it, I did not say it was the only reason, Your assuming way to much so take it down a notch. Laws that regulate hazardous materials in manufacturing as well as recycling have a huge impact on  everything produced even if they are not made in this country. I was involved with manufacturing for 10 years and as of 2006 for example, supposedly all electronics (as well as many other things) coming into this country had to be ROHS compliant.  IF they were not, they could not be sold, Period.  In our factory we made heatsinks for damn near everything. We had computer contracts, military contracts, etc.  The cost of switching manufacturing to non hazardous materials was expensive for almost everyone. Eventually we were forced to downsize due to loss in sales, as our customers had to change the nature of there business to more efficient and cost effective means of manufacturing.  Do i know for a fact that these changes stopped the production of crt's, No, Can you bet it had a huge impact, your delusional if you think it didn't.

you got me on the car thing, I did not mean to make it a blanket statement covering all cars. It was meant to be a guidline as to how "laws" effect manufacturing and selling of products in the united states, countering your point that they do not.  I appreciate the lesson on the cars, but you more or less made my point for me. Now if you don't mind, I try to keep things civil so its not necessary to take things so personal because people disagree with you.

[SignOfZeta]

So, to clarify, you are saying that a "huge" portion of why most CRT TV production moved to Japan in the 70s and 80s was environmental regulation, correct?

I'm not talking about Xboxes melting their lead-free solder joints apart in 2009, I'm talking about CRTs 25 years ago.