Burning cd games at faster speeds, bad or fine?

[Necromancer]

Fact: some people will continue to ignore previously stated reasoning for why cdrs cause premature wear and tear (not to be confused with instant death).  Nothing will sway their beliefs.  Nothing.

[SignOfZeta]

Science a logic go a long way towards convincing me. I haven't see very much of that.

[esadajr]

Did ya test the original AC?  It's probably not putting out what it once did.

Oldskool coil transformers very rarely change its outputvoltage/power over time. either they fully work or they do not at all. but one plausible factor could be oxidation on the plugs which produces a higher contact resistance, which then will result in a power drop.

Tested the old supply with the multimeter. I'm getting 9.33V . So it is probably not making good enough contact with the PCE.

[esadajr]

Conclusion ? The problem is not the disc, CD-R or otherwise. Here's one of the many threads where this was talked about and the possible solution in detail. Basically, you're gonna have to regrease the slider poles of the lens, preferably with white, lightweight lithium grease if you can get it. You need to thoroughly degrease the old grease off of course. Also, don't mess with ANY potentiometers until having done this first...

Thanks for the advice. I'll look into that (and also on a CDX system).

[SignOfZeta]

Did ya test the original AC?  It's probably not putting out what it once did.

Oldskool coil transformers very rarely change its outputvoltage/power over time. either they fully work or they do not at all. but one plausible factor could be oxidation on the plugs which produces a higher contact resistance, which then will result in a power drop.

Tested the old supply with the multimeter. I'm getting 9.33V . So it is probably not making good enough contact with the PCE.

If you are testing it not hooked up to the PCE you aren't really testing it. You need to know if it can still maintain 9V while the PCE is drawing on it, that it can still provide 1A. My hunch is that it isn't.

[fraggore]

The Duos will get physically stuck beyond their range of sled travel with CDRs for some reason. This is certainly a problem, although its easily corrected.

I've never heard "metallic" noises.

My theory is that these systems that die from CDR use were on their last legs anyway. Also, People who run primarily CDRs primarily are also more likely to be low budget late comers with leaky cap black Duos, crappy power supplies, etc.

how do you correct this, i have had this with 3 games on my duo. Just had to take the lid off and more the gears back. Ys 1 and 2 did this at the end fight now and then, and gates of thunder 4 in 1 cd does this all the time, cant remember the other game that did it.

how can this be corrected would love to know.

[SignOfZeta]

Sorry. By "easily corrected" I just meant that it doesn't destroy your Duo permenently.

[fraggore]

ahh ok

[spenoza]

Fact: some people will continue to ignore previously stated reasoning for why cdrs cause premature wear and tear almost instant death (not to be confused with instant death a slight amount of extra wear and tear).  Nothing will sway their beliefs.  Nothing.

Fixed that for you so that it better reflects what I typically hear bandied about by the fear-mongers (not necessarily by you, but by many).

I agree that there may be a slight increase in wear and tear. Not sure why you chose the word premature. The system has wear and tear whenever it is used. Increased wear and tear isn't premature. It's just more. Almost sounds like you were going for premature system death, and it's not premature if it's due to a little extra wear and tear. Premature system death would be "oops, I dropped it". That said, these devices are designed for hundreds and hundreds of play hours. Good CDRs burned well probably have no significant impact on the life of your equipment. If you use cheap CDRs and burn them badly, well, you'll knock a few tens of hours of life off your hundreds and hundreds and you'll end up making repairs just a little sooner than you might otherwise.

Cost-benefit analysis, folks. Very simple. You're all going to have to make repairs at some point because no mechanical device lasts forever, even if well-maintained. So you have to decide if the opportunities you get to play CD games you aren't paying mucho $$ for (or translations you simply can't get otherwise) is worth paying some $$ making repairs a little sooner.

Honestly, if we want to talk about costs, emulate on that PC you've using to access these forums. Download ISOs and emulated them in Ootake or Mednafen (free, both of them). That way you're not putting any wear and tear on your Duo or CD-Rom unit. Heck, make ISOs from your original games and play them on the PC and you can preserve your Duo a lot longer than if you were actually using it. As long as you use your CD unit once a month to keep things limber and the moving parts don't dry up and the belts crack with age, you can preserve your CD-ROM drive much longer by putting almost no wear and tear on it at all. You too can be that old grannie who drives her car once a week and owns it until it simply rusts through.

So make sure you have a good brand burner (they're all pretty generic and capable these days, though), buy good discs like Taiyo Yuden or similar, and burn them at a speed appropriate to the disc and burner (slower will probably yield better results, but your mileage may vary). Chances are if you're getting a stack of 50 discs for $5 and burning them at 48x in that burner that cost you $15.99 at MicroCenter, you'll be making your repairs just a little sooner than you might if you stuck to pressed discs. If you're buying Taiyo Yuden or gold "archival" discs and burning them at the lowest speed supported by the discs and your $50+ burner by a known good brand with good reviews and reliability, I doubt you would really notice any perceptible decline in the lifespan of your CD unit. But even if you're using only originals, you're going to have to pay for repairs at some point. The only way to keep the repairs away forever is to not own the hardware, and then what's the point?

[Black Tiger]

Confirmed logic-supported scientific facts:

Authentic CD games wear out your hardware.
CDRs wear out your hardware.
Your hardware will breakdown even if you never play any kind of CD games, but likely sooner in some ways if you don't play them.
All of the above ailments can be repaired by many people today.

[Aggie Tsubi]

I haven't had much desire for playing CD-Rs on my Duo, preferring to just play the real deal, but I do worry what it may do to my PC-FX. With all the time I've put into Pia Carrot and all the time I'll hopefully put into future fan translations, it makes me wonder. This is getting slightly off-topic, given the forum section, but should any effect be the same on PC-FX, or does it make a difference that that's a slightly more modern piece of hardware?

[NightWolve]

Confirmed logic-supported scientific facts:

Authentic CD games wear out your hardware.
CDRs wear out your hardware.
Your hardware will breakdown even if you never play any kind of CD games, but likely sooner in some ways if you don't play them.
All of the above ailments can be repaired by many people today.

I haven't had much desire for playing CD-Rs on my Duo, preferring to just play the real deal, but I do worry what it may do to my PC-FX. This is getting slightly off-topic, given the forum section, but should any effect be the same on PC-FX, or does it make a difference that that's a slightly more modern piece of hardware?

See above.

[NightWolve]

The Duos will get physically stuck beyond their range of sled travel with CDRs for some reason. This is certainly a problem, although its easily corrected.

I've never heard "metallic" noises.

My theory is that these systems that die from CDR use were on their last legs anyway. Also, People who run primarily CDRs primarily are also more likely to be low budget late comers with leaky cap black Duos, crappy power supplies, etc.

how do you correct this, i have had this with 3 games on my duo. Just had to take the lid off and more the gears back. Ys 1 and 2 did this at the end fight now and then, and gates of thunder 4 in 1 cd does this all the time, cant remember the other game that did it.

how can this be corrected would love to know.

I never heard of this and I don't see how a CD-R disc could be blamed for it in any way. But, I'd say it's time to regrease everything, the slider poles, sprockets, etc. At this point, that's 20 year-old dried out grease that's collected dust to boot. As mentioned, this solves skipping problems when audio tracks are being played. Anyhow, unless there's a sprocket that's worn out/damaged, that'd be the route to try... Doesn't hurt to get fresh oil in that motor as well. That isn't as strong as it used to be either.

The only logical way you could possibly blame a CD-R on this is if you were using say a 750 MB overburned one. But since you're making duplicates of original games that were designed to work with it, that'd never exceed the space limits of pressed discs, the laser is gonna be moving within the expected ranges that it's designed for.

I think how these superstitions build up is because a % of users have finished playing all their originals and now all they're playing are CD-Rs of downloaded games and fan-translated patched ones. Their CD unit was due for eventual servicing, it just happens to be the case that a CD-R was playing when it finally breaks, so presto, blame the CD-R!! Something like that, as Zeta was already explaining. Whatever the case, a CD-R was the last type of disc in there when it broke, so blame the CD-R! I almost did it myself as mentioned in my earlier posts here. I burned a couple of Ys IV CD-Rs at very slow speeds, same problem, then it dawned on me to try a real pressed music CD and a game, and the same shit was happening... Regreasing was the only option I felt I had, and...it worked! Would've sucked if it meant having to replace the laser or mess with the potentiometers.

[SignOfZeta]

I don't know how it happens either but it really does happen. For some reason the laser gets stuck beyond its range of travel and has to be shoved back. AFAIK it only happens on the Duo/SuperCDROM2 deck and not the original CDROM2. It might actually be confined to black Duos come to think of it...

[Necromancer]

Fixed that for you so that it better reflects what I typically hear bandied about by the fear-mongers (not necessarily by you, but by many).

Taking it to the other extreme is just as pointless, as you can't possibly quantify the 'slight' amount of extra wear caused by cdr use.

I agree that there may be a slight increase in wear and tear. Not sure why you chose the word premature. The system has wear and tear whenever it is used. Increased wear and tear isn't premature. It's just more. Almost sounds like you were going for premature system death, and it's not premature if it's due to a little extra wear and tear.

I chose 'premature' because cdr usage will cause the laser to wear out prematurely.  Duh.

Good CDRs burned well probably have no significant impact on the life of your equipment. If you use cheap CDRs and burn them badly, well, you'll knock a few tens of hours of life off your hundreds and hundreds and you'll end up making repairs just a little sooner than you might otherwise.

Nobody knows with any certainty how little (or how much) cdr use will shorten a laser's life, but it doesn't really matter.  My point was that some people will never believe that cdr use has any detrimental effect whatsoever, and even worse, people like zippy will conveniently forget/ignore every technical reason given for why they cause damage and keep telling people there's nothing to worry about.

By the way - not once have I said that people should never use cdrs.  They're great for playing rare/pricey titles and translated stuff, but everyone should know going in that there are indeed risks involved but nothing that can't be fixed for relatively little money.