Shockman Prices?

[Necromancer]

I just hate seeing people get all upset over high prices on a item that isn't a necessity in life. If you really want to get pissed, get pissed at how the cost of food has gone up, but how the minimum wage barely has and is not able to match it. You see sumthings price is crazy high, cool, make fun of it, its cool to laugh and make a joke or two out of it, and a sellers stupidity to boot. But I mean, don't get all pissed off and crap, ranting for pages on end. Its just emotionally un-healthy for anyone to do that, and it adds stress to what is a otherwise enjoyable hobby.  Regardless of how angry you get, the seller isn't going to change his price. Sending them angry or harassing pms about their prices wont help matters either.

Says the undisputed champion of windmill tilting. 

It's obvious from the amount of participation that some people enjoy the thread, but feel free to skip it if you don't like it.  Either way, you're mistaken if you think everyone is giving themselves an ulcer over steep prices instead of simply snagging a few cheap lulz. 

[Black Tiger]

There are only two copies of "Shockman" under current completed eBay listings. One sold at auction for $41 with the manual, aka "complete". The other was the HuCard alone, which failed to sell at $44.99.

eBay is not the Turbo market. It is just the most inflated market at its top end for Turbo games. But today's (not five years ago) collector driven eBay value for Shockman is well below $40.


There are only two completed eBay listings for "AirZonk". One sold for $19.99 and the other with "game, instruction, manual and box" failed to receive the minimum bid of $30.

[Lost Monkey]

There are only two copies of "Shockman" under current completed eBay listings. One sold at auction for $41 with the manual, aka "complete". The other was the HuCard alone, which failed to sell at $44.99.

eBay is not the Turbo market. It is just the most inflated market at its top end for Turbo games. But today's (not five years ago) collector driven eBay value for Shockman is well below $40.


There are only two completed eBay listings for "AirZonk". One sold for $19.99 and the other with "game, instruction, manual and box" failed to receive the minimum bid of $30.

Geez -  how short a period is the "completed listings" search now?  2 weeks?

I remember it used to be as long as the item was still on the site (up to 6 months), then it went to 90 days...

Items are still visible from July, but the completed items search doesn't show them  - you have to see them through feedback links or saved links.

[ProfessorProfessorson]

I just hate seeing people get all upset over high prices on a item that isn't a necessity in life. If you really want to get pissed, get pissed at how the cost of food has gone up, but how the minimum wage barely has and is not able to match it. You see sumthings price is crazy high, cool, make fun of it, its cool to laugh and make a joke or two out of it, and a sellers stupidity to boot. But I mean, don't get all pissed off and crap, ranting for pages on end. Its just emotionally un-healthy for anyone to do that, and it adds stress to what is a otherwise enjoyable hobby.  Regardless of how angry you get, the seller isn't going to change his price. Sending them angry or harassing pms about their prices wont help matters either.

Says the undisputed champion of windmill tilting.  

It's obvious from the amount of participation that some people enjoy the thread, but feel free to skip it if you don't like it.  Either way, you're mistaken if you think everyone is giving themselves an ulcer over steep prices instead of simply snagging a few cheap lulz.  

Like I said, there is better things to get pissed about. The TZD RedFrog days are over(and Redfrog was actually ripping people off, I got items not as described). Its not worth getting pissed about anymore. Not like you guys didn't just run Carlson out of town, even after he offered to sell Cotton outside of ebay to someone here at a lower price. No one was even interested in hearing that or giving him a chance to see if he would, or to see how much. Too busy name calling and chasing him off. Be one thing if he ripped someone off here, but he didn't, unless you have news of otherwise, his only crime evidently, pricing a game higher then you'd like it to be. And its not like he had to come here and address the issue. He doesn't actually need anyone's business here, but again, he tried. I'm not going to sit here and trash this thread arguing with you about that though, so think and feel whatever, I really don't care. Anyone is more then welcome to vent and hate on pricing, just saying, better far more serious shit to get pissed about then the pricing of wants, not needs.

There are only two copies of "Shockman" under current completed eBay listings. One sold at auction for $41 with the manual, aka "complete". The other was the HuCard alone, which failed to sell at $44.99.

eBay is not the Turbo market. It is just the most inflated market at its top end for Turbo games. But today's (not five years ago) collector driven eBay value for Shockman is well below $40.


There are only two completed eBay listings for "AirZonk". One sold for $19.99 and the other with "game, instruction, manual and box" failed to receive the minimum bid of $30.

On Shockman, the one that failed to sell didn't fail. The guy actually listed it the first time around and ran into a non-paying bidder. He then relisted and I guess pulled it because he got a offer outside ebay for 51 bucks or sumthin. I shot him a PM the other day inquiring about it.

EDITED IN:

Addressing this part in particular

eBay is not the Turbo market. It is just the most inflated market at its top end for Turbo games. But today's (not five years ago) collector driven eBay value for Shockman is well below $40.

Its not the Turbo marketplace, but that didn't stop you from taking a sealed Ys3 there first, right? Whats the first place that popped into your head when you decided to sell it? I doubt it was here. And that is fine and all, but don't try to deny the existence of said market place when you yourself have used it to your benefit. And also, it was quite clearly proven that Shockmans going average is not below $40 bucks. Only 2 out of 18 times did that happen, and one of them was via BIN, so either the seller was feeling very generous, desperate for quick cash, or just had no idea on how much to ask for. Either way, the lowest minority number does not decide the going rate, the majority does. To ignore the such is basically the same as sticking your fingers in your ears and saying "blah blah blah blah". You can do that all damn day, but it wont get you anywhere.



I can understand how you'd want ebay to not be the main market for TG-16and PCE games in North America and other areas of the world, but sorry, it just is. Its not like you can just walk into any game store and see a huge, or even decent size and nice selection of Turbo games to select from. You cant even do it here on this forum unless someone parts with a lot of doubles or liquidates his collection. Here you have to wait until someone decides to let their own copies of stuff go for obvious reasons, and even here you can find people raising the price higher then ebay average rates.

Its like having the same mentality that there are no Turbo collectors other then the ones found here, and that's most definitely not true. There are quite a few in my area alone who simply don't care to belong to forum groups because their only interest is actually playing said games, and most of their current NEC shopping is done via Ebay, because there is not many other places to grab NEC related games from. No one brings the stuff into local game stores to trade in because local game stores try to rip them off with low in store credit. Only other choice is CL and ebay.

Over 2 million Turbos sold in America right? Its not like only the 40 or 50 people active on this forum are the only ones left still playing them and buying games for them. Thats why Turbo games sell so well on ebay. Its the quickest, easiest place to access for the majority to find what they want. This community is great, dont get me wrong, but it doesn't even come close to representing the majority of Turbo users around the world. Its better to just accept that and just feel pride in the fact that this system is still going strong in many gamers eyes all over the world well past a Japan 87 launch. Thats quite a accomplishment in and of itself, regardless of where the majority of games are being bought and sold at.

[Marll]

I found a copy locally in Kirkland, WA with the HuCard, sleeve and mint manual for $18. I think that shop owner didn't realize what he had at the time, and I wasn't about to tell him.

[turboswimbz]

Enjoy where this thread has gone, On the shockman that was re listed, He may have made second chance offers, and someone took it after a few days?  Anyway I actually came across a loosey for $40 in the past day. (not a great price by any means) I got it, (for no reason other than I could) It'll always make for a good trade later on, being it's on the rare side. 
 
I'm finding Ebay is 10% skill in searching and bidding, and 90% luck, on whether you can find what you want at a deal.

[vestcoat]

Not like you guys didn't just run Carlson out of town, even after he offered to sell Cotton outside of ebay to someone here at a lower price. No one was even interested in hearing that or giving him a chance to see if he would, or to see how much. Too busy name calling and chasing him off.

Hey, let's give credit where credit is due - the flame war with MagGear was 90% me. I know 16-bit is honest in his dealings and I respect his mature, nonviolent online persona, but $500 for Cotton is f-bombing trippin' balls cuckoo. Talk is cheap and to say that he's willing to haggle is a lot different than just offering a fair price upfront. Also, asking $500 for a $150 game doesn't leave much room for a fair compromise. He tried to appease us by mentioning that he sold another copy in the past for a paltry sum of <$300, which only reinforces how insane and far from reality his prices are.

At this point in a conversation, you usually respond with some variation of "he can do what he wants" and I know that. Likewise, we're not obliged to like what other people do and we're free to tell them so to their face.

We both agree that Turbo gaming is a hobby, so I don't understand how you can defend a guy whose only contribution is buying a game for $100+ and trying to resell it for $500. That's not how I'd define a hobbyist; folks like that can go elsewhere.

[ProfessorProfessorson]

Not like you guys didn't just run Carlson out of town, even after he offered to sell Cotton outside of ebay to someone here at a lower price. No one was even interested in hearing that or giving him a chance to see if he would, or to see how much. Too busy name calling and chasing him off.

Hey, let's give credit where credit is due - the flame war with MagGear was 90% me. I know 16-bit is honest in his dealings and I respect his mature, nonviolent online persona, but $500 for Cotton is f-bombing trippin' balls cuckoo. Talk is cheap and to say that he's willing to haggle is a lot different than just offering a fair price upfront. Also, asking $500 for a $150 game doesn't leave much room for a fair compromise. He tried to appease us by mentioning that he sold another copy in the past for a paltry sum of <$300, which only reinforces how insane and far from reality his prices are.

At this point in a conversation, you usually respond with some variation of "he can do what he wants" and I know that. Likewise, we're not obliged to like what other people do and we're free to tell them so to their face.

We both agree that Turbo gaming is a hobby, so I don't understand how you can defend a guy whose only contribution is buying a game for $100+ and trying to resell it for $500. That's not how I'd define a hobbyist; folks like that can go elsewhere.

I honestly have no idea what he paid for it. Did he actually state the actual amount he paid? And I mean even then, who cares. Its his business, not mine. He doesn't owe me or anyone any kind of explanation of how he got it, or how much he paid for it. And I'm not disputing the fact that 500 is extreme for the game, but I know enough about the guy to know if a member here contacted him about it odds are fair he'd maybe let them have it for a lot cheaper then that I am sure, or if they met up with him at a convention. And I mean, hypothetically, if he had told you, or anyone else that was ragging on him that he would take lets say $240 or sumthin for it right then, would you have grabbed it? Did you even have the cash laying around anyway? Either way, for me, I don't care if its $150 or 250 or 500. I'd rather buy the PCE version. Its the same game, but far cheaper.  

Also, it may be more then anything that he listed a high price because thats what it would take for him to let it go out of his own collection. Some people seem to have this perceived notion that his only interest in games is as a business, and its not. He plays and collects games too, just like anyone else here. I can vouch for this because I have done work for him prior. Not saying this IS his situation, but sometimes from a collectors point of view, its hard to let go of something. Maybe you'd be willing to, but only if a certain amount can be had, regardless of actual market value, simply because you know you may not get another one any time soon. It ends up being on  of those situations where you are basically having to talk someone out of a game instead of simply looking at them as a seller. You have to make it worth it to him to let said item go. Sometimes no reasonable amount you offer will do.

[HercTNT]

The seller has the right to charge what they want. The buyer has the right to pay or not pay. Thats commerce folks. Your not entitled to the game, and bitching bout it cause you don't feel like paying the stated price is silly. Don't like it, save your breath, and move on. there will be other opportunities.  Argue it any way you like till your blue in the face, its just that simple.

[FiftyQuid]

Enjoy where this thread has gone...

Me too.  I've only posted the once, but I've read everything in it's entirety.  Great discussion.

I'm finding Ebay is 10% skill in searching and bidding, and 90% luck, on whether you can find what you want at a deal.

^^^ This, but I will change it up a bit.  10% skill, 10% patience, 10% timing, 70% luck.  My only real option for turbob is eBay.  Is it the devil?  It can be, but it's also put me in touch with a bunch of Turbo enthusiasts that I never would have met without it.  For example, one of my first bulk TG purchases happened through eBay.  A seller posted about 12 games I wanted.  All of them were overpriced.  I was new to TG pricing, but I still knew they were overpriced.  So I contacted the seller through eBay and told him.  Then I went a step further and made him an offer on all 12 games.  We bartered back and forth and finally decided on a price.  He cancelled all his auctions and I sent him cash through PayPal.  Risky?  Yes, but he upheld his side of the deal and I received the games within a week.

The point of my story is that eBay, while absolutely absurd in pricing, average pricing, and fees is still a very resourceful tool for resourceful individuals.  By the way, this is only one of my examples.  I've made a few back alley deals through eBay and even had a seller send me a few items for $0.  They just saw that I was a fan and shipped me a few things.  You need to be a good judge of character, and lucky, but it does happen.  As for my 'legit' purchases through eBay, I've said in the past that the average price I've set for myself is $20 on each game.  If I bid and get it cheaper then it's a welcomed bonus.

For Shockman it was unrealistic to hope to get it for $20.  Possible?  Maybe, but unlikely, at least for me.  So my set price was $40.  I think if you use eBay in this manner then you won't overbid/pay for anything.  Of course I would never pay $500, let alone $200 for Cotton.

[vestcoat]

actual[/b] amount he paid? And I mean even then, who cares. Its his business, not mine. He doesn't owe me or anyone any kind of explanation of how he got it, or how much he paid for it. And I'm not disputing the fact that 500 is extreme for the game, but I know enough about the guy to know if a member here contacted him about it odds are fair he'd maybe let them have it for a lot cheaper then that I am sure, or if they met up with him at a convention. And I mean, hypothetically, if he had told you, or anyone else that was ragging on him that he would take lets say $240 or sumthin for it right then, would you have grabbed it? Did you even have the cash laying around anyway? Either way, for me, I don't care if its $150 or 250 or 500. I'd rather buy the PCE version. Its the same game, but far cheaper.  

Yeah, he did say something about paying "over $100" for it, so $500 is a pretty extreme markup. And like I was saying, even $200-300 is extreme. I sold a mint sealed copy in a pimped out, 10-day auction six months ago and got $230 for it. He also implied that getting the price down to under $300 would require buying a bunch of his other over-priced junk for a quantity deal.

Also, it may be more then anything that he listed a high price because thats what it would take for him to let it go out of his own collection. Some people seem to have this perceived notion that his only interest in games is as a business, and its not. He plays and collects games too, just like anyone else here. I can vouch for this because I have done work for him prior. Not saying this IS his situation, but sometimes from a collectors point of view, its hard to let go of something. Maybe you'd be willing to, but only if a certain amount can be had, regardless of actual market value, simply because you know you may not get another one any time soon. It ends up being on  of those situations where you are basically having to talk someone out of a game instead of simply looking at them as a seller. You have to make it worth it to him to let said item go. Sometimes no reasonable amount you offer will do.

Well, there may be reasons he's holding onto it that I'm not aware of, but he's already sold other copies, so it's unlikely he needs it for his collection.

The seller has the right to charge what they want. The buyer has the right to pay or not pay. Thats commerce folks. Your not entitled to the game, and bitching bout it cause you don't feel like paying the stated price is silly. Don't like it, save your breath, and move on. there will be other opportunities.  Argue it any way you like till your blue in the face, its just that simple.

To be clear, my gripes don't come from an inability to buy the game. I have Cotton. I also have the PCE version. I also had a second sealed U.S. copy and I sold it. There aren't any remaining U.S. or PCE games that I particularly care to buy. The crazy prices for TG16 games these days don't directly effect me; they annoy me. I guess I just have a real problem with grown men thinking they deserve to make a living by leeching off one of my hobbies. With the internet we have no need for such middlemen. I can't fathom one single service or contribution to society provided by such parasites. Anyone could do what they do. They have no talent; they have no skill. They feed, they gouge, they inflate, they suck, they pussify America, and they're a waste of food.

*whew*
Time to make some tea.

[HercTNT]

I guess I just have a real problem with grown men thinking they deserve to make a living by leeching off one of my hobbies

commerce is commerce. I highly doubt people are sitting around saying "how can i gouge vestcoat today". everyone wants to make a buck. there is always another copy of a game, being sold

by another seller. if your wasting that much thought and energy on your opinion of a person's pricing, a deep breath and tea may be in order.

I also would like to make the following point to keep this in perspective. I making an example here so, don't read to deep. If anyone here had X game that numerous people would be willing to

pay $400 for, is there anyone here that can honestly say they would let it go for only $50 as not to offend anyones personal view of pricing?  Now its one thing to be a select community like

Pcefx were you give others with common bonds a break. But ebay is commerce plain and simple. supply and demand, fair or not is irrelevant.

[BigusSchmuck]

Emulation should have killed this type of gouging. But it didn't, if anything it made this stuff even more desirable just to have the actual copy instead of playing a digital one. Chalk another one where piracy actually helped people buy the stuff they download.

[Black Tiger]

I guess I just have a real problem with grown men thinking they deserve to make a living by leeching off one of my hobbies

commerce is commerce. I highly doubt people are sitting around saying "how can i gouge vestcoat today". everyone wants to make a buck. there is always another copy of a game, being sold

by another seller. if your wasting that much thought and energy on your opinion of a person's pricing, a deep breath and tea may be in order.

I also would like to make the following point to keep this in perspective. I making an example here so, don't read to deep. If anyone here had X game that numerous people would be willing to

pay $400 for, is there anyone here that can honestly say they would let it go for only $50 as not to offend anyones personal view of pricing? Now its one thing to be a select community like

Pcefx were you give others with common bonds a break. But ebay is commerce plain and simple. supply and demand, fair or not is irrelevant.

Not everything has to be in such extremes, but yeah, this does happen all the time here. A lot of these kinds of deals I've been involved in as a buyer or seller,  that aren't fully public, I don't brag about afterward.

Even though as I said, it doesn't have to be as extreme as a $200 game selling for either $50 or $400, people are more and more frequently straight up giving away games for free. Including Shockman, whether you believe it to be a $40 game or a $150 game.

What people like vestcoat react more to is the non oblivious doing crooked things to manipulate the market. Like buying up evetything at or below current market price to ransom a game at an unatural price ir just straight up lying about a game in listings.

People like to use phrases like "free market", but in real business in North America there is no such thing. There are all kinds of laws and regulations in place designed to try to try to stop sellers from taking advantage of buyers.

You can say why discuss this type of stuff, but then why discuss anything else here? Why have such negative threads as "What stupid crap have sellers told you when buying Turbo items"? Why ever say anything bad about any game or about bad games?   

If this is a hobby, then all of this interests various people. If you play games "jus' cuz", well that's cool too. But why tell other people what to do and ask why they are discussing a discussion that you also joined to discuss?

I'm just surprised that the gougers have managed to braineash so many buyers into a sellers perspective. When those of you who only concentrate on high end prices shop
for new regular products, do you also ignore evetything but the highest prices? I thought that the phrase "shopping around" meant the exact opposite for a buyer. There are stores that sell new games for $10 more than most, some that sell it for $10 less and a few where at leadt one of them is going to have it on sale for $20 - $30 less.

When someone asks where to buy it and what they should pay, do you send them to the $10 above average store and not let them know about the places they could find it on sale? Do you tell some other friend who stops them and does mention the sale places/price to shut up and not talk about those places/prices?

[Necromancer]

Don't like it, save your breath, and move on.

Take a dose of your own medicine.  If you deem the gouging thread (and others like it) a waste of time, don't read 'em.

But ebay is commerce plain and simple. supply and demand, fair or not is irrelevant.

You obviously don't understand the idea of gouging; the $500 Cotton was labeled as a gouge job because it is well above where supply and demand has previously set the price.