Duo save capacity comparisons and/or alternatives requested

[SignOfZeta]

IIRC we used the Nanami Bank utility to unlock . That one use alone justifies the existence of this tool.

I haven't used it since though...kind of laborious.

[esteban]

IIRC we used the Nanami Bank utility to unlock

. That one use alone justifies the existence of this tool.

I haven't used it since though...kind of laborious.

I remember that. I still haven't played that*! Damn it!


* Force Gear, dumbasses.

[dshadoff]

First, the Tennokoe Bank's battery *can* go dead, and it does *not* recharge while in use in the Turbo system - so the original, 20-year-old batteries are probably basically dead or untrustworthy.

However, it can be replaced with a new battery of type CR2016.
Note that the battery was not originally considered replaceable, and it is soldered in place rather than a battery holder.

CR2025 and CR2032 could also be used, and are higher-capacity batteries, but are thicker and would make the cartridge bulge even more than it already does.  I suggest buying a battery with leads already welded to it, as the leads will accept solder more readily than the battery itself would... and heating the battery directly with a soldering iron could be dangerous.  This type was used in the original cartridge as well.
For example:  http://www.batterymart.com/p-rc2016-3v-75m-lithium-battery-solder-tabs.html

The plastic cover on the cartridge is held on by super-thin double-sided tape.  I once had pictures of the replacement process and may even have made a webpage for it at one time... but I've forgotten where I put them.



OK, and the second thought I had was about the Nanami tool.
I really like it, but I had a few ideas for its improvement - though I likely don't have enough time to implement them myself:

1) Instead of requiring the user to painstakingly transcribe a long data stream, a 2D barcode could be displayed, and scanned by cellphone.  Not sure if this could make a file directly, but it could certainly go to a website (including QUERY data) to convert/generate such files for download.

2) Individual games' data should be separable and recombinable.  This is not so difficult, since the storage format is pretty well-understood.  There are two reasons for doing this: a) so that indivdual game saves could be archived, traded, studied, etc. (like the unlock of Force Gear in Tokimeki Memorial stated above), and b) to reduce the size of data displayed by the barcode, to make it less problematic.

[termis]

OK, and the second thought I had was about the Nanami tool.
I really like it, but I had a few ideas for its improvement - though I likely don't have enough time to implement them myself:

1) Instead of requiring the user to painstakingly transcribe a long data stream, a 2D barcode could be displayed, and scanned by cellphone.  Not sure if this could make a file directly, but it could certainly go to a website (including QUERY data) to convert/generate such files for download.

2) Individual games' data should be separable and recombinable.  This is not so difficult, since the storage format is pretty well-understood.  There are two reasons for doing this: a) so that indivdual game saves could be archived, traded, studied, etc. (like the unlock of Force Gear in Tokimeki Memorial stated above), and b) to reduce the size of data displayed by the barcode, to make it less problematic.

#1 - that's a clever idea.  me likes.
#2 - I might be misunderstanding you, but the tool does save individual files one at a time (rather than the whole bank like ten-no-koe).  In fact, you have to save the files individually.

I'd add #3 in creating an all-necessary-files-included, easy-to-use GUI interface.  I would guesstimate that currently, 80%-90% of potential users would probably fail to get this nanami bank working at the current state, or wouldn't even bother trying in the first place.  There's not only the cryptic command prompt interface, but you also have to download few additional tools, put them in your working directory, or set the right path in your settings, etc - And all this is all before any binary code recording/typing (though #1 would take care of that issue)...

[SamIAm]

Crazy idea: What if you made a program for the PCE that broke down the bytes of each internal save file into 1's and 0's, then played these as a steady stream of audio beeps (maybe taking advantage of stereo) that could be recorded via direct analog connection, analyzed based on waveform peaks, and converted back into a save file? It'd be like a modem, just a lot slower. Sounds more reliable than a barcode to me.

[Necromancer]

Crazy idea: What if you made a program for the PCE that broke down the bytes of each internal save file into 1's and 0's, then played these as a steady stream of audio beeps (maybe taking advantage of stereo) that could be recorded via direct analog connection, analyzed based on waveform peaks, and converted back into a save file? It'd be like a modem, just a lot slower. Sounds more reliable than a barcode to me.

I believe Bonknuts did something like that.

[Bardoly]

So, grahf's Memory Base 128 thread got me to thinking about save capacity again.

I did some searching, and I came up with he following information which I would like to either have confirmed or denounced as incorrect:

This webpage says that the PC Engine Duo-RX has more save capacity than the PC Engine Duo and Duo-R.  I would like to have as much save capacity as possible without needing to deal with additional hardware, so if this is true, then I suppose that I need to hunt down a Duo-RX.

[SignOfZeta]

I'm not an expert on such things, and I've never owned an RX (just an R, which I had always though was identical to the RX save the controller) but this guy is saying that the Duo had 2kb of save space and the RX had 192. Nearly 100 TIMES as much save space? Which he says "somewhat rectified the issue".

If one system at 100 times the save space as a IFU/Duo/DuoR then it would more than "somewhat" fix "the problem" it would eliminate it completely because, seriously, you really don't need saves for a game you haven't played in 7 years. Just play it again, you won't remember WTF you were doing anyway.

BTW, the Memory Base 128 is mostly useless and I think the guy writing this article doesn't know what he's talking about, AFAIK.

[Necromancer]

Yarr, that guy's full o' beans; they all have the same amount of save space.  Maybe he's mixed up with the extra 192kb of ram that all Duos have.

P.S. - I bet if you searched the interweb tubes long enough you'd find a site falsely claiming that the Duo-RX has the Arcade Card built in.

[Black Tiger]

Hi Leg Fantasy overwrote all of the save files in my Duo RX. I'm assuming, because there wasn't enough space. I ran into save file space warnings with various games on my Duo RX, the same as on every other PCE/Turbo CD-ROM (I haven't tried a Super CD-ROM yet though).

[Tatsujin]

never heard of that as well.

[grahf]

Super CD-rom has the same 2k as the others.

[Tatsujin]

so, super gayjin ultra gamer was wrong?

[Official Ninja]

First, the Tennokoe Bank's battery *can* go dead, and it does *not* recharge while in use in the Turbo system - so the original, 20-year-old batteries are probably basically dead or untrustworthy.

However, it can be replaced with a new battery of type CR2016.
Note that the battery was not originally considered replaceable, and it is soldered in place rather than a battery holder.

CR2025 and CR2032 could also be used, and are higher-capacity batteries, but are thicker and would make the cartridge bulge even more than it already does.  I suggest buying a battery with leads already welded to it, as the leads will accept solder more readily than the battery itself would... and heating the battery directly with a soldering iron could be dangerous.  This type was used in the original cartridge as well.
For example:  http://www.batterymart.com/p-rc2016-3v-75m-lithium-battery-solder-tabs.html

The plastic cover on the cartridge is held on by super-thin double-sided tape.  I once had pictures of the replacement process and may even have made a webpage for it at one time... but I've forgotten where I put them.



OK, and the second thought I had was about the Nanami tool.
I really like it, but I had a few ideas for its improvement - though I likely don't have enough time to implement them myself:

1) Instead of requiring the user to painstakingly transcribe a long data stream, a 2D barcode could be displayed, and scanned by cellphone.  Not sure if this could make a file directly, but it could certainly go to a website (including QUERY data) to convert/generate such files for download.

2) Individual games' data should be separable and recombinable.  This is not so difficult, since the storage format is pretty well-understood.  There are two reasons for doing this: a) so that indivdual game saves could be archived, traded, studied, etc. (like the unlock of Force Gear in Tokimeki Memorial stated above), and b) to reduce the size of data displayed by the barcode, to make it less problematic.

Hi. I removed the top of my Tennokoe Bank card and I see a battery CR2320 in there. So was my battery already replaced maybe? It looks like the lid was hot glued and not two sided tape... I ordered a CR2016 with solder tabs and will replace the battery as soon as i get the new one. I'm just wondering. Is CR2320 the original or was it replaced?

[A Black Falcon]

I'm not an expert on such things, and I've never owned an RX (just an R, which I had always though was identical to the RX save the controller) but this guy is saying that the Duo had 2kb of save space and the RX had 192. Nearly 100 TIMES as much save space? Which he says "somewhat rectified the issue".

If one system at 100 times the save space as a IFU/Duo/DuoR then it would more than "somewhat" fix "the problem" it would eliminate it completely because, seriously, you really don't need saves for a game you haven't played in 7 years. Just play it again, you won't remember WTF you were doing anyway.

I believe that guy is confusing RAM and save memory.  They are not the same thing. :p  I've never heard from credible sites that the RX actually has more save memory.  I guess it'd be nice if someone could confirm that for sure though.

BTW, the Memory Base 128 is mostly useless and I think the guy writing this article doesn't know what he's talking about, AFAIK.

Actually, if you read that MB128 thread that was linked, I'm pretty sure that via certain, specific games you can in fact back up the system's internal save onto the MB128, and thus CAN use it as a big memory backup unit... so yes, it is quite useful!