Author Topic: Tra$lation Compen$ation - Anearth Fantasy Stories  (Read 2885 times)

m1savage

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Tra$lation Compen$ation - Anearth Fantasy Stories
« on: January 05, 2013, 04:31:21 PM »
I know everyone already has a lot they are working on and that it's not about the money. However, since my last standing offer expired, I thought I'd renew it for the new year.

I will pay (via Paypal) $150.00 to anyone who successfully makes a playable, English translated version of Anearth Fantasy Stories for the PC Engine.

I will also pay someone $40.00 to translate the following text for me into English.

http://m1sz1.com/pics/finaldumpclean.txt

Contact me if interested in translating the text.

Happy new year to all and good luck on all your projects!

Offer expires November 1, 2013



SignOfZeta

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Re: Tra$lation Compen$ation - Anearth Fantasy Stories
« Reply #1 on: January 05, 2013, 05:30:52 PM »
If I thought anyone could translate that game for $150 I would have offered ages ago.

To find someone who could even do it, who had the skills, wouldn't flake out, and could actually deliver the product in less than a couple of years...at that point the money is hardly even a factor.

I would gladly contribute money to such a project, I just don't know if it would actually help.

NightWolve

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Re: Tra$lation Compen$ation - Anearth Fantasy Stories
« Reply #2 on: January 05, 2013, 05:34:00 PM »
Pretty generous of you! Now wasn't EsperKnight and team (SamIAm) considering or already working on this ?? I thought this was on their list...

Another History Flashback: I dunno how many were aware of this, it *is* buried in the Ys IV Project History section of the ReadMe, but I once offered the famous Neill Corlett (of Secret of Mana 3/Bahamut Bagoon hack fame) $250 to get him back working on the Ys IV hacking (he DID leave me with the Ys IV decompression code) for two remaining difficult tasks mainly: 1) reverse the decompression code he had uncovered, 2) hack the font routine to support full English, variable width if possible. The 3rd task was to *MAYBE* go the distance, if possible, to implement subtitles for the voice acting... Anyhow, he considered my offer, told me it was very respectable, but ultimately turned it down to work on other things...

At the time, he was busy with his PSF system: software to extract sound code from Playstation1 games, store it, along with a Winamp plugin to play the format back. He tackled PS2 games after that as well. Funny enough, a couple of years later way after the Ys IV text patch was released, I randomly sent him an email asking about a technical question, DLL loading in Windows and the relocation concept, something like that, and as an aside he mentioned that he should've taken me up on that ole $250 offer! ;) Well, not only did I not have to pay someone for something that I couldn't do, David Shadoff, who eventually came through for the project and did what was necessary, wound up donating $100 to *me* to boot, in addition to his time/expertise!! =)
« Last Edit: January 05, 2013, 06:22:47 PM by NightWolve »

m1savage

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Re: Tra$lation Compen$ation - Anearth Fantasy Stories
« Reply #3 on: January 05, 2013, 05:54:58 PM »
It's been on a couple of peoples lists over the years. Nightwolve, you may even remember this, but many years ago there was a group of about 7 or 8 of us offering money for someone to translate it and I think the reward was up to something like $600. Of course at that time it wasn't really even considered to be possible. :) 

Like I said, I'm sure no one would go out of their way to do it just for the money but consider it my preorder if they do.

NightWolve

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Re: Tra$lation Compen$ation - Anearth Fantasy Stories
« Reply #4 on: January 05, 2013, 05:56:10 PM »
That sure as hell is news to me, I never heard about no $600!!!!! Given the 99% freeloading rate you statistically find here (fan translations), that figure is shocking to hear! ;)

SamIAm

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Re: Tra$lation Compen$ation - Anearth Fantasy Stories
« Reply #5 on: January 05, 2013, 08:32:02 PM »
It's very kind of you to offer, but I know I for one would rather not get paid for it. The pressure to deliver would ruin some of the fun, and adding money to the mix can strain relationships between people cooperating to get the job done.

I really wish Xanadu II would come faster, but Esperknight has a family and a full time job, so it's inevitable that the pace is going to be slow. Since it's all volunteer work on his part, though, I'm nothing but grateful for the work he puts in. Xanadu II is a pain in the ass to hack, as well.

On that note, I still think that the Saturn version of Anearth Fantasy Stories might be vastly easier to hack. That may take the magic away for folks on this forum, but you have to be practical about these things.

What the PCE translation scene needs above all else is hackers taking the initiative, because the whole process of translating a game starts with a script dump. I guarantee that if you advertised on romhacking.net that you had a clean, workable script dump of any one of the more impressive CD RPGs, you'd get a translator quickly enough.

m1savage

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Re: Tra$lation Compen$ation - Anearth Fantasy Stories
« Reply #6 on: January 06, 2013, 02:26:20 AM »
SamIAm - I'm really looking forward to Xanadu II and appreciate the work you guys are putting into it. I promise not to pay you for it when it's complete.  :lol:  Seriously though, I understand what you're saying about money mucking up things at times.

The Saturn version would be pretty cool since they're essentially the same game but it still doesn't interest me as much as the PCE version.

spenoza

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Re: Tra$lation Compen$ation - Anearth Fantasy Stories
« Reply #7 on: January 06, 2013, 05:48:47 AM »
Maybe the money should be offered to a hacker to dump and then re-insert the script. Translators are, as previously mentioned, much easier to find. It is possible that if many people are as willing as you are to pony up cash a cool sum could be accumulated.
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Djangoo2

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Re: Tra$lation Compen$ation - Anearth Fantasy Stories
« Reply #8 on: January 06, 2013, 12:46:46 PM »
In my experience it is best if the money is split between all major members of a translation and some form of compensation to everyone else who lent a hand. Really, that's the only fair way to go about it. $150 split between a few members isn't really much when you break it down. So that said, it is best that money takes a back seat until a translation is finished because really the goal of fan translators should be to produce a professional quality translation and that takes time, months to years. The amount of work that would have gone into a project cannot be covered by a few hundred bucks, unless you don't value the amount of work that goes into a translation, and it should be treated as a bonus for finishing a translation.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2013, 12:50:41 PM by Djangoo2 »

NightWolve

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Re: Tra$lation Compen$ation - Anearth Fantasy Stories
« Reply #9 on: January 06, 2013, 01:58:50 PM »
I promise not to pay you for it when it's complete.  :lol:  

Well, that's the standard, default behavior of the public, so no worries... You're not ever gonna endanger it with such offers. ;)

I think what spenoza said makes sense, if you could find a hacker to build all the tools to extract the script, insert it back in, along with a font hack, and a decent patching system, etc. you can worry about finding a translator later. Get the difficult programming/reverse engineering stuff out of the way. After that, then try to find a translator. They're more likely to do the translation for free as well; most that I met are very anti-profit and all into the fan credo ideology (as in, fanatics). Shimarisu (majority translator of Ys IV) was the only exception who was caught on eBay selling Ys IV originals with a fully-patched CD-R to up the price.

Anyway, the main problem is all you did is make a post here and are essentially hoping for the best. You gotta be more of an activist for it than that. You need to market the offer in more places and also fire off emails/PMs to known hackers with a track record. EsperKnight came to mind, but SamIam spoke on that, but the next person off the top of my head is Bonknuts. He's an expert with the variable-width font hacks and could probably handle figuring out the text decompression code, etc. David Shadoff is another guy, as mentioned, but you probably couldn't tempt him, even with the full $600. He's been working on Cosmic Fantasy 1 for years, so it's an issue of time and since he does very well at his job as an IT consultant, $600 would be chump change to him not to mention the game in question has been on his list already!! ;)

I would've taken you up on that $600 offer if I had seen it years ago AND if it was for a PC game though! I got good enough to hack most PC games over time, given all the knowledge, tools, etc. available on the Windows platform and my prior x86 assembly experience going into it. With NEC games for an old 8-bit console, there was no interactive debugger with the emulators when the Ys IV project began and you've got primitive hardware/software, so it was hard for someone like me to dive into it. You needed very exceptional talent like a Neill Corlett for that aspect and compression algorithms were never my thing either, so David Shadoff saved the day after Neill.

With PC games, it's much easier to track down the decompression code, rip it out, figure out how the parameters work and compile it in your own project with additional "C" written modules to use. You don't have to understand it and when it comes to recompression, you can hack the executable to bypass normal procedures of decompress and load, and skip it forward to the loading, so you leave your image or text replacements as plain files, without compression, etc. That's how I got it done with my PC Ys projects. Later games use standard ZLIB (Zip/unzip) though which is freely available for download and use, so you'd never have to learn how the algorithm works. Early games used custom algorithms, I had a hunch Ys I Complete uses something called LZO, but yeah, it was irrelevant to me in the end. You have much more control and options to bypass problems like this on a Windows PC game than with an old console game and its primitive hardware/instruction set, along with the lack of advanced tools (advanced disassemblers) to work with it, etc. You don't get to cheat... ;) (I hear these days that Mednafen has a decent debugger though, but I've never tried it.)
« Last Edit: January 06, 2013, 02:20:00 PM by NightWolve »

HercTNT

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Re: Tra$lation Compen$ation - Anearth Fantasy Stories
« Reply #10 on: January 06, 2013, 02:07:56 PM »
It would be nice if there were some kind of "kickstarter" fund if you will for translations. I can see how money would really gum up the works though.

SamIAm

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Re: Tra$lation Compen$ation - Anearth Fantasy Stories
« Reply #11 on: January 06, 2013, 03:00:23 PM »
A little thank-you money put together after the release is one thing, but actually making a contract with someone using money as an incentive is quite another.

A key problem is that it's very hard to predict how many hours it will take to successfully hack a game. Xanadu II, for example, didn't appear at first to be anywhere near as hard as it's turned out to be. A hacker can't really predict if he's committing to 20 hours of work or 100. If he's not in it mostly for the fun of it, you probably stand an even greater chance of him flaking out before the work is done.

Lastly, I do have to mention that even though a lot of fan-translators are happy to work for free, it would be dangerous to pay the hacker hundreds of dollars while the translator gets nothing. I'd like to think I'd be fine if someone wanted to start paying Esperknight and not me, but I'm only human, and it could start to bother me after a while. I do paid translation work too, and I could definitely use $600 myself.
« Last Edit: January 07, 2013, 01:47:21 AM by SamIAm »

m1savage

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Re: Tra$lation Compen$ation - Anearth Fantasy Stories
« Reply #12 on: January 06, 2013, 04:14:25 PM »
It seems very hard to me to find anyone to do the translation part. For example, the text file in my original post isn't very large (relatively) but since it's from a mahjong game, no one is interested. I posted it on Romhacking forums and asked anyone there to give me a price on translating it but not a single person responded. Luckily, I've got the menus, locations and mahjong terms translated and (half-assed) inserted so I'll just carry on from there for now.


Keith Courage

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Re: Tra$lation Compen$ation - Anearth Fantasy Stories
« Reply #13 on: January 06, 2013, 04:43:44 PM »
I say just use something like google translate. Even if the translation isn't %100 perfect it's much better then not knowing what is being said at all. Much like what was done for STARTLING ODYSSEY II
« Last Edit: January 06, 2013, 05:01:34 PM by Keith Courage »

ElSeven

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Re: Tra$lation Compen$ation - Anearth Fantasy Stories
« Reply #14 on: January 06, 2013, 10:23:29 PM »
this game seems to popup on many translation wish lists, mine included!  This game is so awesome, if only I could understand what was actually going on...

I have no skills to offer as far as a translation project, but I'd be happy to help make this happen if I knew how.  The work that went into the Ys IV english translation & dub is outstanding. I'm currently playing through it for the first time and am floored by the quality of the translation/voice acting.  The fact that Xanadu II is in the works is also very exciting.

Anearth in english would be awesome.  And even though it has been brought up and shot down a million times, I also wish Snatcher would get translated too.  Yeah, the sega cd version is in english, but imo there is really no (other) reason to own a sega cd.  Both Snatcher and Anearth would make great additions to the english scd library.  Hopefully interest in PCE will continue to grow over time so that more translation-abled hackers will be interested in these projects, or any great pce game for that matter.
currently playing:
PCE - Raiden
SNES - Chrono Trigger
DC - Fast Striker

PCE LP