spreading tg16 like a virus

[Gentlegamer]

The reason TG-16 failed in NA was that it came out too damn late.  If it had come out here the same time it came out in Japan (1987 instead of 1989) they would have blown away anything else in the market at the time.  Hudson Soft could have established itself in 1987/88 as THE console to have.  A strong customer base could have set them up for years to come just like it did in Japan.  Unfortunately, Japan was not a large enough market to establish themselves on the same footing internationally as Nintendo. 

Just think of all the the third party software support if they had usurped Nintendo in 1987.   By 1989 when the Sega Genesis came along they could have overcame their hardware deficiencies with the CD drive and Supergrafx but by then, it was really too late.  Unfortunately, they waited until 1989 (when it was beginning to become obsolete technology), marketed it poorly, and never really committed to the NA market.  It was doomed from the start.

NA was still reeling from the Video Game Crash, and it took the herculean efforts of Nintendo to revive it. So bringing it in 1987 would have been even less successful.

[Black Tiger]

My TG16 was a gift so I don't know how much it cost, but I seem to recall my Turbo CD costing $199 from McDuff Electronics when I got it.  Assuming $190 for a Turbo, then it + the CD add-on would cost almost $400...

If the Turbo-CD was already that low, then the TG-16 would have been <$99.99.


DO THE MATH






In 1991 the TurboExpress + 4 games retailed for $199.







These images are immorally hotlinked from tg-16.com.

[ctophil]

It would be interesting if the scenario changed around--Sega Genesis failed, while Turbografx-16 went head-to-head with the SNES.  Or the SNES failed and we would have Sega vs. NEC wars. 

My first 16-bit console was the SNES.  Yeah, I was a Nintendo fanboy.  But what would happen if NEC became a big hit?  I could of been an NEC fanboy and so would millions of other gamers.  Video game history would change a lot.  What if NEC was the Nintendo of today?  NEC would still be making Turbografx-512 or something like that.  Sony wouldn't have started the Playstation at all.  Because guess what?  The only reason why Sony created the Playstation was because they were working with Nintendo to make the SNES a CD-Rom based system.  Sony took the blueprints of the potential SNES CD and made the Playstation.  NEC already had the Turbo CD add-on.  Why would they work with Sony?

Microsoft would probably still make Xbox.  So you would probably have a modern scenario as NEC vs Microsoft vs Nintendo.  It's interesting to imagine what NEC would be doing these days to innovate and compete if the Turbografx-16 became a huge hit. 

[vexcollects]

Yep. Radio Shack in Canada. I remember going to Radio Shack when I had my first TG16. I also remember the bin of blow out sale games (in boxes) right before the end. I also remember how I looked at those and thought, I don't need these anymore because I have a whateverconsolewaspopular system now. Me in my youth! So dumb.

I think it probably failed for a combo of reasons. Kids (parents) bought game systems and other kids didn't talk about the TG16. Kids wanted Mario and Sonic not Keith Courage. Maybe it wasn't promoted enough, or not featured in the right stores. Maybe the big N and Sega paid more for advertising.

I worked at EBgames about 14 years ago. I remember how hard it was to convince someone that the Dreamcast was actually a great system and the PS2 at the time was not that great (PS2 had just been released, we saw a lot of broken units, graphics were visibly worse in the early cross platform games (IE: Dead or Alive)). I remember a lady said to me once while buying a new PS2, "What is a Dreamcast? Isn't that just a knock off PS2?" The ignorance shattered my soul since the Dreamcast had been around for a while already. I nearly strangled her with my lanyard.

Point is, people follow people. One shiny object pulls two people in one direction, four more follow, and 20 more follow them. It was bad luck for the TG16. Maybe it just didn't seem as shiny at the time.

Look at Apple. They were so shiny and still are. You could tell people that a puppy will die each time you purchase an iPad and they'd still buy 2 each. Maybe even brag about how they bested the mortality of a puppy for that sweet white monolith.

[escarioth]

Yep. Radio Shack in Canada. I remember going to Radio Shack when I had my first TG16. I also remember the bin of blow out sale games (in boxes) right before the end.

Haha that made me remember something funny  back then at radio shack,
my friend wanted to buy neutopia...but his little sister kept whinning never having games to play
so his parent asked him to buy instead a game for the whole family...and he got Darkwing duck....

even today , he still remember that choice and he get pretty mad 

[jordan_hillman]

I think that's why the Jaguar and 32X never bothered to get off the ground. Yeah, they were the "new, cool technology!" but they had f*ck-all for games. There is a grand total of five 32X games I own/want to own, and maybe 5 for the Jaguar, which is so little, a Jaguar I will never get.

I owned a jaguar and a decent amount of games for it, and let me tell you: the only two games worth owning on that shit box are Alien vs Predator and Tempest 2000. Nothing else is worth a damn. About 9 months or so ago I traded my total Jaguar collection, and a few other things I can't recall, for a copy of Dungeon Explorer 2, Soldier Blade, Neutopia II, and some other kick ass more common TG titles, and I couldn't be more happy.

Long story short, TG kicks ass!

[escarioth]

I owned a jaguar and a decent amount of games for it, and let me tell you: the only two games worth owning on that shit box are Alien vs Predator and Tempest 2000. Nothing else is worth a damn. About 9 months or so ago I traded my total Jaguar collection, and a few other things I can't recall, for a copy of Dungeon Explorer 2, Soldier Blade, Neutopia II, and some other kick ass more common TG titles, and I couldn't be more happy.

Music to my ears...seriously a friend of mine keep telling me how GREAT a jaguar is...and seriously... every games he keeps making me play...are either ok...or just plainly bad. 

[seieienbu]

I loooove Tempest 2000.  Aside from it, Aliens vs. Predator, Wolfenstein, Doom, and Raiden are pretty good.  Every other Jaguar game that I've played is somewhere between mediocre to awful.

There's also a surprisingly robust homebrew scene for the Jaguar too.  Considering how hard programming for the system was reputed, I find that quite surprising.

[vestcoat]

Dear clackattack, seieienbu, and other noobs: it doesn't matter what you remember seeing a TG16 priced at in your local store.
1) your memory sucks and none of you have even mentioned the year
2) between official price drops and individual store sales and added bundle deals, a random price without a date from Bumf*ck, USA means nothing.

This isn't that hard. Use the internet and cite sources.  Or dig through whatever EMG magazines, scans, TG16 books, and JC Penny Catalogs you have lying around.

Launch prices were:
TG16 $199 (confirmed widely on internet)
TGCD $399 (Bantam Encyclopedia + internets)
TE $299 (Bantam Encyclopedia, EGM, + internets)
TurboDuo $299 (official mailings, EGM, + internets)

The TG16 launch price was comparable to that of the NES, SNES, and Genesis. I don't care to lookup all of the price drops, but by the '91 holiday season, the TG16 had dropped to $99 and the CD-ROM to $299, according to EGM's 1992 Buyer's Guide.

The reason TG-16 failed in NA was that it came out too damn late.  If it had come out here the same time it came out in Japan (1987 instead of 1989) they would have blown away anything else in the market at the time.  Hudson Soft could have established itself in 1987/88 as THE console to have.  A strong customer base could have set them up for years to come just like it did in Japan.  Unfortunately, Japan was not a large enough market to establish themselves on the same footing internationally as Nintendo. 

Just think of all the the third party software support if they had usurped Nintendo in 1987.   By 1989 when the Sega Genesis came along they could have overcame their hardware deficiencies with the CD drive and Supergrafx but by then, it was really too late.  Unfortunately, they waited until 1989 (when it was beginning to become obsolete technology), marketed it poorly, and never really committed to the NA market.  It was doomed from the start.

U.S. consoles were ALWAYS released a year or so after their Japanese versions back then. The NES came out twenty-seven months after the Famicom. The TG16 came out twenty-two months after the PC Engine. The Genesis came out ten months after the MegaDrive. The SNES came out nine months after the Super Famicom. True, the TG16 had a slightly longer turnaround than its later competitors, but when you throw around the "1987" release date, remember that the PC Engine was an extremely slow starter with only five games released that year. Software didn't pick up until mid-1988. Even Bantam's officially-licensed TurboGrafx Encyclopedia says the PC Engine was released in 1988.

Regardless, your claim that the TG16 should have received a simultaneous, insta-release in 1987 so it could beat the Genesis' usual ten-month delay after the Mega Drive is a double standard and absurd, as are your claims about its deficiencies and obsolescence. The PC Engine was one of the longest-lived consoles of its era. The SuperGrafx was abandoned because the PC Engine wasn't obsolete. The PCE's huge library of stunning shooters, RPG's, and fighting games show no hardware deficiencies as bad as Genesis color mud or SNES slowdown.

There are plenty of reasons why the TG16 failed, but get your facts straight and stop regurgitating the "doomed from the start" crap you hear on youtube.

[escarioth]

There are plenty of reasons why the TG16 failed, but get your facts straight and stop regurgitating the "doomed from the start" crap you hear on youtube.

I dont agree on that "doomed from the start" too. 

[vexcollects]

I'm just looking for my stack of JC Penny catalogs from the late 80's to confirm prices. Oh wait....I'm in a city that doesn't have one. That's probably why I can't find them. Weird, cause I thought I saw them next to my Ralph's grocery flyers from 1990-1993. Damn.

[schweaty]

U.S. consoles were ALWAYS released a year or so after their Japanese versions back then. The NES came out twenty-seven months after the Famicom. The TG16 came out twenty-two months after the PC Engine. The Genesis came out ten months after the MegaDrive. The SNES came out nine months after the Super Famicom. True, the TG16 had a slightly longer turnaround than its later competitors, but when you throw around the "1987" release date, remember that the PC Engine was an extremely slow starter with only five games released that year. Software didn't pick up until mid-1988. Even Bantam's officially-licensed TurboGrafx Encyclopedia says the PC Engine was released in 1988.

Just because that's how it was ALWAYS done is not a sound business strategy.  It's how companies go out of business.  Successful business strategy is identifying an underserved market and establishing yourself within that market early.  The same principle applies to the "US market still reeling from the video game crash" argument.  The US had never seen anything like what Nintendo, Sega, and NEC were about to bring overseas.  It was a completely different dynamic.

Regardless, your claim that the TG16 should have received a simultaneous, insta-release in 1987 so it could beat the Genesis' usual ten-month delay after the Mega Drive is a double standard and absurd, as are your claims about its deficiencies and obsolescence. The PC Engine was one of the longest-lived consoles of its era. The SuperGrafx was abandoned because the PC Engine wasn't obsolete. The PCE's huge library of stunning shooters, RPG's, and fighting games show no hardware deficiencies as bad as Genesis color mud or SNES slowdown.

Yes it is a double standard to expect a US release closer to the JP release, but it is hardly absurd.  That's what successful businesses do.  They should have identified the same unique product advantage they had in JP (1st and only 16-bit console at the time) and applied in the new (larger) market in the US.  They could have established the same sort of customer base they had in JP which they could have leveraged into software support (which is what Nintendo did).  And I didnt say they were obsolete, I said they were on the way to becoming obsolete (which they definitely were by the time the SNES came out).  The Supergrafx was a desperate attempt to try and regained relevance.  If it had a normal product development cycle and rolled out as part of a larger plan instead of just thrown against the wall to see if it would stick, it could have been pretty successful.

There are plenty of reasons why the TG16 failed, but get your facts straight and stop regurgitating the "doomed from the start" crap you hear on youtube.

This is not regurgitated youtube crap.  I have an MBA.  Its based on education and a fundamental understanding of economics and business principles.  Maybe its too much for you to take in all at once, so read the above a couple of times before you speak out of turn again.

BTW - If anyone thinks I'm starting a hardware war of words ala EvilEvoIX.  I'm not.  I love the TG-16.  I wouldnt have it any other way.  I just wish they were as good at the business side of the industry as they were at making games.

[jelloslug]

TE $299 (Bantam Encyclopedia, EGM, + internets)

Actually the launch price for the Turboexpress was $249.  I know that because I bought one right when it came available.  There were manufacturing issues with the screens though and the price went up to $299 very soon afterwards.

[Necromancer]

And I didnt say they were obsolete, I said they were on the way to becoming obsolete (which they definitely were by the time the SNES came out).

I stopped reading when I got to here.

[jelloslug]

Here is the 1990 Sears Christmas catalog:



and the 1991 Sears Christmas catalog: