Xanadu II Translation Development Blog

[elmer]

While I've enjoyed improving my compression code, it's always humbling to be reminded that you're not the smartest cookie on the block! 

Here's how 3 other popular (and free) compression algorithms do with the LoX2 data ...

Total uncompressed data size             : 23,278,006
Total YsIV compression                   : 10,347,187
Total Emerald Dragon compression         : 10,280,860
Total Anearth compression (with preload) :  9,716,445
Total Anearth compression (no preload)   :  9,706,570
Total Legend of Xanadu 1 compression     :  8,937,897
Total Legend of Xanadu 2 compression     :  8,324,785
Total Elmer's SWD4 compression           :  8,114,319
Total Elmer's SWD5 compression           :  8,035,016
Total Jørgen Ibsen's aPLib compression   :  7,782,457
Total Pasi Ojala's puCrunch compression  :  7,780,261
Total Magnus Lind's Exomizer             :  7,377,469

[ccovell]

If you don't count the continentals, you win!! 

[elmer]

If you don't count the continentals, you win!! 

Haha ... those darned Nordic programmers with too-much-time-indoors during their long Winter! 

Exomizer and puCrunch have too much decompression overhead for my comfort, and we're generally not *that* desperate for space on the PCE, IMHO.

But aPLib is fascinating to me ... it's a pure, fast, LZSS-variant, just like my SWD code ... but Jørgen Ibsen came up with a better encoding scheme than mine. 

<edit>

I can foresee an SWD6 in the near future!

I came, I saw, Jørgen conquered! 

It's not just the encoding, which I can recreate, I think that he's also doing some output-optimization of the emitted codes.

He's beaten me! 

So, if I need a good compressor in the future, I'll probably end up using aPLib!

[elmer]

Well ... whoops! We forgot to translate the maps that you pick up in LoX2! 

They've been extracted now, and we're looking at getting the text translated, and maybe see about improving the contrast and color choices at the same time.

Falcom were using some very strange colors in those maps that just don't make a lot of sense.

When they're done, it'll be time to share another pretty picture and keep this thread alive! 


***************************

In other news, a post on romhacking by Tengai-Makyou-translator Tom made me think about the text printing in the LoX games, and why the "slow" text speed seems like such a waste-of-time, and I always immediately switch to the "fast" text speed.

He's got a good point, and looking at the text printing in the LoX games, it doesn't flow like speech, it just gets printed out, one character after another.

So, there's no reason to look at it in "slow" mode, and I always change it to "fast" instead.

I took a look at Anearth for comparison, and they're definitely adding pauses in their printing, especially when you get both text and voice at once. It looks a lot better.


So ... I've added a couple of script-codes to Falcom's script language, and made some changes to my script-compiler, and now both LoX games actually feature natural speech delays at the end of sentences and for other punctuation.

The message boxes just look a whole lot nicer now, IMHO, and I actually prefer the "slow" text mode, with the delays. It just "reads" better. 

The delays are removed when you select "fast" text mode, so anyone that just wants to button-through stuff can still get the same quick response as before.

[ccovell]

Wow, that's attention to detail. 

[incrediblehark]

I really appreciate this addition! While I am a fairly quick reader, I prefer the text to scroll as i'm reading it as opposed to quickly appearing on screen. I find the dialogue sounds better in my head as I read it and the pauses in speech are a nice touch.

[elmer]

While I am a fairly quick reader, I prefer the text to scroll as i'm reading it as opposed to quickly appearing on screen. I find the dialogue sounds better in my head as I read it and the pauses in speech are a nice touch.

It's definitely a big help in making the text interesting to read, IMHO. You can actually imagine someone speaking it as you read.

It also adds that immediate extra "perception-of-quality" when you first start playing the games, even if you turn it off later on.

I can't remember how common an effect it was BITD, but IIRC I don't really remembering it being used until later on in the 4th generation, or maybe even early on in the 5th generation.

But it's not always a good idea, and it doesn't suit every game. It would have driven you mad in the Ys games, with their bump-into-someone-to-talk, because you'd be constantly waiting for text to appear as you accidentally run into people.

Wow, that's attention to detail. 

Thanks!  :oops:

Yeah, part of the idea here is to show just how darned-good the PCE is, which means putting in all the UI tricks that you wouldn't normally see on the TG-16, because neither NEC nor TTi nor Working Designs could afford to spend the time & money to change the original Japanese game too much.


The question is ... when to stop messing around with stuff?

I could probably backport LoX2's nice textured message boxes back into LoX1 ... but is that a step too far?

LoX1 doesn't display text in as many colors as LoX2 does, but it has most of them available.

That's another possible change that we could make to the scripts. But should we?


Now that we might be in the position, amazingly enough, to have a small fighting-chance of actually putting together a dub that could rival, or even beat, Ys I & II ... where should these little "upgrades" stop? 

[Michirin9801]

I can't remember how common an effect it was BITD, but IIRC I don't really remembering it being used until later on in the 4th generation, or maybe even early on in the 5th generation.

EarthBound did that on the SNES! It had a fairly robust text display system where some words or phrases would appear slower or faster than normal depending on not only who was talking but what they were saying, sometimes they'd also space out the characters in a word in order to 'make a big deal' of it, the small pauses between phrases were also a thing in that game and they made the game's text feel much better paced than usual for 16 bit RPGs, and that's not to mention the Mr. Saturns who had their own font...
I don't like reading a whole lot in video games, but I always found that reading was a lot more fun in EarthBound than in most other games!

[Gredler]

was a lot more fun in EarthBound than in most other games!

SMMMMAASSHHHHH

[Michirin9801]

was a lot more fun in EarthBound than in most other games!

SMMMMAASSHHHHH

I've actually played EarthBound before Smash, so when I unlocked Ness I knew exactly where he was from ;3

[Gredler]

I've actually played EarthBound before Smash, so when I unlocked Ness I knew exactly where he was from ;3

I played it at launch, loved it and kept my copy since then. It's a great game, and does great stuff with the way text is displayed - I agree - and figured the Smaaash during the battles when you get a critical is a great simple example.

I was referring to the way that when you get a critical hit a special font with a special text-reveal displaying the text SMMMAAAASSHHHH occurs, which I thought was the most apparent example of the way they create emotion in the player with how the text is displayed and revealed/animated.

The screen flashing helps (I feel like there was screen shake too), but I always got excited when I got a critical hit more than any other text/turnbased rpg because of that SMAAASSHHH. I cant find a youtube video of what I am talking about

I've never played a whole lot of smash brothers, that's after my time in the local multiplayer age range hahah

[elmer]

EarthBound did that on the SNES!
...
I don't like reading a whole lot in video games, but I always found that reading was a lot more fun in EarthBound than in most other games!

Hmmmm ... I just took a look at a YouTube video of Earthbound.

So they using a small (5 pixel wide) VWF font on a solid background, and they're printing the text pretty darned fast, but with pauses, sometimes.

Both LoX games print a lot slower than that, at a much more comfortable reading speed.

SamIAm posted this pcefx-forum private teaser (i.e. please do not share this) a long time ago that shows the game's slow text speed (with the beeps), and its fast text speed later on (no beeps).

A lot has changed since this was made, but the printing speeds are the same.




*************

Here's an animated mockup to see what LoX1 would look like with the LoX2 textured background and drop-shadow.

Remember ... LoX1 lets you select whether to use a transparent box and outlined bold text, or a solid box and narrow text (like LoX2).




Does anyone have an opinion?

[Michirin9801]

Transparent boxes? How are they printing transparent dialogue boxes?
Also, I can't stress enough how beautiful LoX2 looks~
The text speed seems fine too...

Oh and, the textured BG for text in LoX1 would be a pretty damn good addition! I think it makes the dialogue boxes less boring-looking (not that they look boring or anything)

I've actually played EarthBound before Smash, so when I unlocked Ness I knew exactly where he was from ;3

I played it at launch, loved it and kept my copy since then. It's a great game, and does great stuff with the way text is displayed - I agree - and figured the Smaaash during the battles when you get a critical is a great simple example.

I was referring to the way that when you get a critical hit a special font with a special text-reveal displaying the text SMMMAAAASSHHHH occurs, which I thought was the most apparent example of the way they create emotion in the player with how the text is displayed and revealed/animated.

The screen flashing helps (I feel like there was screen shake too), but I always got excited when I got a critical hit more than any other text/turnbased rpg because of that SMAAASSHHH. I cant find a youtube video of what I am talking about

I've never played a whole lot of smash brothers, that's after my time in the local multiplayer age range hahah

Oh yeah, I had kinda forgotten that... I mean most people I talk to only know EarthBound because of Smash Bros, and when they say "Smash" they're more often than not referring to Smash Bros, so I kinda just went with it...
You're right about the "SMAAAASH" critical hits btw...

I played a LOT of Super Smash Bros. on the N64 as well as Melee, but the main driving force of my enjoyment of the series had been the "Nintendo Fangasm" you know what I mean? And by the time I played Brawl that feeling had already died down, so I just played the Subspace Emissary story mode and then pretty much never again... Smash just isn't my kind of fighting game, it sure is fun, but it's no Street Fighter...

[elmer]

Transparent boxes? How are they printing transparent dialogue boxes?

As you might guess ... the dialogue boxes are actually sprites.

Also, I can't stress enough how beautiful LoX2 looks~
The text speed seems fine too...

Thanks! We haven't made any changes to the game window itself ... Falcom's graphics are beautiful.

All the "improvements" that we've made (since that video) have been purely in the UI side of things.

The slow text speed is a nice "reading" speed for conversations that you haven't seen. But I could certainly understand some people wanting to switch to fast text if they're less interested in the dialog.

Oh and, the textured BG for text in LoX1 would be a pretty damn good addition! I think it makes the dialogue boxes less boring-looking (not that they look boring or anything)

I know what you mean. Large single-color boxes often just look dull and rather 8-bit (IMHO).

But ... it was still pretty common in the 16-bit era.

[ParanoiaDragon]

I definitely like the textured boxes more, looks nicer that way!