Daimakaimura (Ghouls n Ghosts) Question

[elmer]

It doesn't play as well as the Genesis version I don't feel. The Genesis trumps the other versions because Arthur doesn't come to a dead stop if you inadvertently press a diagonal direction. This makes the SuperGrafx (and even the arcade) version have much stiffer control than the Genesis version.

Well, it takes a tiny 18-byte patch to make Daimakaimura behave the way that you want.

But I'm not going to tell you which 18 bytes because you failed to acknowledge the "obvious" superiority of the SuperGrafx in all areas of gaming!  Whether that's true or not, I choose to believe it anyway ... it's a religious thing.  And now I'm also going to have to send an Invisible Pink Unicorn around to your house to poop on your lawn! 

[Black Tiger]

Black Tiger could probably fix up the color palettes with better choices if they were found, too.

It's tough doing a color hack, where you can only change existing colors within existing sub-palettes. A port with assets as close to the arcade as Forgotten Worlds PCE does to its arcade original would look great, but here's a straight palette adjustment from one of the tougher sections of the SuperGrafx game to balance and make faithful:

[jeffhlewis]

Sharp x68000 + Roland MIDI Module is my go-to way to play this game...and it's amazing. But yeah, for the price of this setup (or even a SuperGrafx + Game) you can get the freaking arcade PCB. Or build a perfect MAME cabinet and emulate it. Just do that.

[poponon]

does nobody own a saturn?

[Black Tiger]

does nobody own a saturn?

You should know by now that most people here like 16-bit games and do not ignore half the library just because a technically superior version of a game is available on random consoles or through emulation.

The Saturn version is also not arcade perfect, if that's what someone is looking for. But why spend so much money on on the Saturn game and hardware when you can emulate the arcade for free?

[poponon]

does nobody own a saturn?

You should know by now that most people here like 16-bit games and do not ignore half the library just because a technically superior version of a game is available on random consoles or through emulation.

The Saturn version is also not arcade perfect, if that's what someone is looking for. But why spend so much money on on the Saturn game and hardware when you can emulate the arcade for free?

saturn version is the closest to the arcade to my knowledge. also burnt discs are pretty cheap. and software emulation is fine and all but you know you're not going to be getting the most accurate version of the game, as well as having to get into a bunch of other hardware if you want to run at native 15khz.

imo alot of the 2d saturn games feel very 16 bit gen. kind of like an upgraded snes. especially in daimakaimura's case it gameplay feel is more or less the same to it's 16 bit counterparts.

the art for the supergrafx and mega drive boxes are really cool though

[Necromancer]

I don't have a Saturn nor do I want one, especially not for something like Ghouls and Ghosts.  The question is which is better between the Genesis and SGX versions (I prefer the graphics of the SGX by far), but if you're going to widen it to include all versions, why would anyone pic the Saturn version over the X68000 port or mame?

[elmer]

A port with assets as close to the arcade as Forgotten Worlds PCE does to its arcade original would look great, but here's a straight palette adjustment from one of the tougher sections of the SuperGrafx game to balance and make faithful:

Thanks ... I like your colors better! 

Sharp x68000 + Roland MIDI Module is my go-to way to play this game...and it's amazing.

 

does nobody own a saturn?

You should know by now that most people here like 16-bit games and do not ignore half the library just because a technically superior version of a game is available on random consoles or through emulation.

Yes, I own a Saturn ... but I agree with Black Tiger on this.

The joy of these old systems is the games, and the efforts that people went to to try to convert arcade games to the hardware that was available to the players that wanted to play at home ... at the time that the arcade games came out, and not a decade later.

saturn version is the closest to the arcade to my knowledge. also burnt discs are pretty cheap. and software emulation is fine and all but you know you're not going to be getting the most accurate version of the game, as well as having to get into a bunch of other hardware if you want to run at native 15khz.

Errr ... the arcade version is the "closest" to the arcade version. The game was many years old when it came out on the Saturn, and didn't exactly stress the hardware.

I see no problem with running the game in MAME, and I don't see much reason to run it on a 15KHz monitor, either.

Arcade games were designed to be played on RGB CRT monitors ... they're not specifically designed to take advantage of the pixel smearing that you get on an 15KHz NTSC TV when using a composite input.

I don't see anything wrong with running them on a 31KHz PC CRT.

Perhaps I'm missing something.

******************

If anyone wants to run the SuperGrafx Daimakaimura with Joe's "preferred" controls, where accidental diagonals on the joypad don't cause Arthur to stop, here's a PCEAS patch to accomlish that ...

    code
    bank $00
    org  $0000

    incbin "daimakaimura.sgx"

    bank $00
    org  $e62d

    jsr  $ffe0

    org  $ffe0

    sta  $2249,x
    bpl  L1
    bit  #$20
    bne  L2
L1: ora  #$50
    sta  $2249,x
L2: rts

[Black Tiger]

The Saturn version runs at a lower resolution, like most of its CPS1 & 2 ports. The Playstation version likely uses the correct or a closer resolution, just like most of its CPS1 & 2 ports.

The Saturn version is supposed to have one or two different bgms.

The Saturn version doesn't have Arthur walk behind the grass the way that only AirRaidX and a couple guys around LA noticed.

Regular people don't do modchip installs and modded Saturns aren't cheap. The original game is reasonably priced though.

There isn't an industry standard computer program that downgrades console ports consistently. The 8 & 16-bit ports of GnG are each unique experiences and should be played by everyone who appreciates the game.

[poponon]

Errr ... the arcade version is the "closest" to the arcade version. The game was many years old when it came out on the Saturn, and didn't exactly stress the hardware.

I see no problem with running the game in MAME, and I don't see much reason to run it on a 15KHz monitor, either.

Arcade games were designed to be played on RGB CRT monitors ... they're not specifically designed to take advantage of the pixel smearing that you get on an 15KHz NTSC TV when using a composite input.

I don't see anything wrong with running them on a 31KHz PC CRT.

I mean closest as in the look and gameplay . this is just my opinion tho. same with the monitor - i think it looks best on 15khz rgb imo. as long as your enjoying the game tho

[poponon]

I don't have a Saturn nor do I want one, especially not for something like Ghouls and Ghosts.  The question is which is better between the Genesis and SGX versions (I prefer the graphics of the SGX by far), but if you're going to widen it to include all versions, why would anyone pic the Saturn version over the X68000 port or mame?

x68000 is pretty cost prohibitive compared to saturn. I figured most people would have a saturn but i guess it's not that popular around here. you guys should really take another look at it - really awesome selection when you really start going through the library.

i think my main issue with x68000 or mame is mostly emotional/pavlovian  - not sure what it is but i prefer playing on a videogame console than pc. I am considering building a mamebox that outputs to an old crt though - just seems to take a little fun out of it for me. not sure why

[Joe Redifer]

The Saturn version runs at a lower resolution, like most of its CPS1 & 2 ports. The Playstation version likely uses the correct or a closer resolution, just like most of its CPS1 & 2 ports.

Why do you think the PS version offers a closer resolution to the arcade than the Saturn version? They likely share the same exact assets. The Saturn can to 320, 352, 640 and 704 pixels wide in progressive mode. PlayStation goes up to 640 wide. I'm not sure if it even offers a 352 mode. I can only find the 320x22 and 640x480 mode online for the PS1.

EDIT: I found this in regards to the Playstation, which would still put the Saturn version closer to the arcade's 384 dots wide if they used independent resolutions:
   +-------+--------------------+-------------------+
   |  Mode | Resolution (H x V) |       Scan        |
   +-------+--------------------+-------------------+
   |   0   |     256 x 240      |                   |
   |   1   |     320 x 240      |   Non-Interlaced  |
   |   2   |     512 x 240      |                   |
   |   3   |     640 x 240      |                   |
   +-------+--------------------+-------------------+
   |   4   |     256 x 480      |                   |
   |   5   |     320 x 480      |    Interlaced     |
   |   6   |     512 x 480      |                   |
   |   7   |     640 x 480      |                   |
   +-------+--------------------+-------------------+


Any why y'all forgetting about the BEST version which is for the Master System?

[esteban]

I don't have a Saturn nor do I want one, especially not for something like Ghouls and Ghosts.  The question is which is better between the Genesis and SGX versions (I prefer the graphics of the SGX by far), but if you're going to widen it to include all versions, why would anyone pic the Saturn version over the X68000 port or mame?

x68000 is pretty cost prohibitive compared to saturn. I figured most people would have a saturn but i guess it's not that popular around here. you guys should really take another look at it - really awesome selection when you really start going through the library.

i think my main issue with x68000 or mame is mostly emotional/pavlovian  - not sure what it is but i prefer playing on a videogame console than pc. I am considering building a mamebox that outputs to an old crt though - just seems to take a little fun out of it for me. not sure why

I have Saturn

But, needless to say, I love playing ports of games on all te consoles I own, even if they are not "the best"...I can't tell you how much fun it is to compare different versions.

[Joe Redifer]

Agreed! It's really fun to contrast and compare different versions. It's less fun when the game is the same on every platform.

[ccovell]

I can't find an accurate chart online, but that PSX one is wrong, I reckon.  The PlayStation can produce a couple more in-between resolutions, like 384 (or so) pixels across that make CPS1 games fit near-perfectly.