Tire Question

[BlueBMW]

That's odd. My BMW shows the colours for each tyre and a number figure for each in either bar psi or Kpa. But the oil doesn't have a gauge just "ok" or top up. Also it doesn't have a dip stick. I hate that.

Must be the newer ones that do that.  Bummer for the BMW techs

[SignOfZeta]

The original Miata had an actual analog oil pressure gauge. It was eventually replaced a few years later with a switch based one, fake basically, just a gauge that looks like a gauge but does the same thing as a light. Right around the same time GM made the same change with their light trucks.

Customers who think they are informed are a constant source of irritation. If you give some people a tiny amount of data all they can do is find imaginary problems with it.

[TDIRunner]

I've seen many vehicles that require different pressures in the front vs. the rear, but never between the right side and the left side.  As others have said, I would check them manually just to verify it isn't the TPMS.  I would also make sure you check the tires when they are cold.  I've actually seen situations where a car is sitting outside with the sun beating on one side, and the other side sitting in the shade.  I checked the tire pressure and sure enough, the side sitting in the sun was higher than the other side.  I didn't change the air pressures since I assumed that if everything was the same temperature, the pressures probably would have matched.

I don't mind the idea of the TPMS, but at the end of the day, I still prefer to check them myself.  I recently bought a new van for my wife and it's the first vehicle I've ever owned with a TPMS.  It has the type I prefer, in that it only warns you if one of the tires is low, but it doesn't have the ability to tell you which one.  I also doesn't have anything inside any of the tires themselves, so I don't have to pay extra any time I buy new tires.

[xelement5x]

The original Miata had an actual analog oil pressure gauge. It was eventually replaced a few years later with a switch based one, fake basically, just a gauge that looks like a gauge but does the same thing as a light. Right around the same time GM made the same change with their light trucks.

Customers who think they are informed are a constant source of irritation. If you give some people a tiny amount of data all they can do is find imaginary problems with it.

Lol, I am like this to a fault.  I'm even worse with medical stuff, every time I get bloodwork done I go over every tiny part just to bring it up with my doctor and have him be like "yeah, nothing really to worry about though, you're still within tolerances."

[BlueBMW]

The 1970 mercedes roadster I had several years ago had an oil pressure gauge that had an actual oil line running to it.  So you had a line of hot engine oil behind the gauge cluster at all times.  Kind of concerning I suppose...

[Desh]

I've seen many vehicles that require different pressures in the front vs. the rear, but never between the right side and the left side.  As others have said, I would check them manually just to verify it isn't the TPMS.  I would also make sure you check the tires when they are cold.  I've actually seen situations where a car is sitting outside with the sun beating on one side, and the other side sitting in the shade.  I checked the tire pressure and sure enough, the side sitting in the sun was higher than the other side.  I didn't change the air pressures since I assumed that if everything was the same temperature, the pressures probably would have matched.

I don't mind the idea of the TPMS, but at the end of the day, I still prefer to check them myself.  I recently bought a new van for my wife and it's the first vehicle I've ever owned with a TPMS.  It has the type I prefer, in that it only warns you if one of the tires is low, but it doesn't have the ability to tell you which one.  I also doesn't have anything inside any of the tires themselves, so I don't have to pay extra any time I buy new tires.

TPMS is aggravating to me.  A cost passed on to the consumer thanks to federal law.  A law enacted mainly after the Ford/Firestone fiasco (which TPMS wouldn't have really made a difference) as well as people not checking their own tires, having a blowout, and causing a wreck  Makes total sense to go through all that because people are to lazy, negligent, ignorant to check tire pressures.  Basic mechanical ability like checking tires, oil level, etc. NEEDS to be taught as part of driver's ed.

[SignOfZeta]

Yeah, but it isn't and it's not on the books to ever take place. Anyone can see this. So in that situation do you just let people die or do you do something about it?

The list of federally mandated safety features on American cars is so huge that TMPS is barely noticeable. Furthermore it's actually useful. Maybe you are so vigilant you check your pressures every time you get in the car, but the causes of tire deflation generally take place with the car IN MOTION so unless you have superpowers TPMS is the only way to know it's happening when it's happening.

And you're right, it wouldn't have helped the Firestone Ford Explorer problem because those were terrible drivers in a terrible car. Nothing could save those people. However, I went over a nasty pot hole last year and when the light came on it wasn't hard to put 2 and 2 together. I'm a master automobile mechanic with an almost perfect driving record on and off the track who can totally rebuilt all four of my cars from the ground up and I find TPMS useful. I think resistance is due more to ego than anything, honestly. The same people complained about pretty much every advance in auto technology since Unsafe at Any Speed. Collapsible steering columns, EGR, exhaust catylizers, seat belts, safety glass, unitized construction, fuel injection, 3rd brake lights, ABS, airbags, synthetic oil, crash bars, crumple zones, etc etc. the end result is that cars are many times safer than they used to be and only need maintenance annually, and now most of the time even shitty cars like Chryslers can run a quarter million miles without problems. Every car sold today puts less hydrocarbon out its exhaust than what exists in the air naturally. Fuel economy per pound is WAY up. Adjusted for inflation cars don't cost any more than they did 35 years ago and mechanics make way less.

The "cost" of TPMS was minimal at introduction and now with wheel speed based systems it's actually free. I think TPMS is f*cking great and the only reason there wasn't a light for it 60 years ago is because the tech wasn't there. If it were, we'd be used to it. 

If you're getting a raw deal in relation to your car it's honestly coming from your bank, your insurance company, or the cops. The OEMs are packing maximum value as long as you don't buy something stupid like a Jeep Compass or an X6M.

[Desh]

Yeah, but it isn't and it's not on the books to ever take place. Anyone can see this. So in that situation do you just let people die or do you do something about it?

The list of federally mandated safety features on American cars is so huge that TMPS is barely noticeable. Furthermore it's actually useful. Maybe you are so vigilant you check your pressures every time you get in the car, but the causes of tire deflation generally take place with the car IN MOTION so unless you have superpowers TPMS is the only way to know it's happening when it's happening.

And you're right, it wouldn't have helped the Firestone Ford Explorer problem because those were terrible drivers in a terrible car. Nothing could save those people. However, I went over a nasty pot hole last year and when the light came on it wasn't hard to put 2 and 2 together. I'm a master automobile mechanic with an almost perfect driving record on and off the track who can totally rebuilt all four of my cars from the ground up and I find TPMS useful. I think resistance is due more to ego than anything, honestly. The same people complained about pretty much every advance in auto technology since Unsafe at Any Speed. Collapsible steering columns, EGR, exhaust catylizers, seat belts, safety glass, unitized construction, fuel injection, 3rd brake lights, ABS, airbags, synthetic oil, crash bars, crumple zones, etc etc. the end result is that cars are many times safer than they used to be and only need maintenance annually, and now most of the time even shitty cars like Chryslers can run a quarter million miles without problems. Every car sold today puts less hydrocarbon out its exhaust than what exists in the air naturally. Fuel economy per pound is WAY up. Adjusted for inflation cars don't cost any more than they did 35 years ago and mechanics make way less.

The "cost" of TPMS was minimal at introduction and now with wheel speed based systems it's actually free. I think TPMS is f*cking great and the only reason there wasn't a light for it 60 years ago is because the tech wasn't there. If it were, we'd be used to it. 

If you're getting a raw deal in relation to your car it's honestly coming from your bank, your insurance company, or the cops. The OEMs are packing maximum value as long as you don't buy something stupid like a Jeep Compass or an X6M.

If I'm not mistaken indirect TPMS (Wheel speed monitored) does not meet federal law after 07' model year requiring the use of direct sensors.  This IS additional cost that doesn't need to be there.  Sensors, receiver, additional wiring and changes to body control modules are all production and development cost.  They also are a nice little $100 plus replacement to the consumer when one goes bad.

This isn't much different than when electronic stability control and traction control became a federal mandate in 09ish?  Some vehicles I was happy to have it, others not so much.  Those electronics got me stuck in the snow in my Chevy Express work van plenty of times.  Aggravation! 

So cars are the same cost as years past adjusted for inflation.  So what?  You wouldn't like the choice of possibly a cheaper alternative?

Maybe I'm old school but I check tire pressure every time I fill with fuel.  I also check tire pressure anytime there's a large temperature swing in the weather. 

Yes, I have gotten flat tires while driving, it's not hard to figure out when there is a noise or the car is handling different that you need to slow down and pull over as soon as it's safe.  I have also hit my fair share of chuck holes and yes, I pull over when it's safe to inspect for damage.  These all seem like common sense items to me.

I just feel like laws are passed everyday that help make society more and more lazy and more and more dependent on electronics.

As far as emissions, I can agree with stipulations set in place there.  Crash testing I can also agree with to some extent.  This again should be a choice and an option that would be a SELLING point in our capitalist system. 

If none of these laws were in place do you really think we'd still be buying Yugos?  Natural sales competition would drive manufacturers to better their product in every way to keep up with competition.  Case in point the now federally mandated crap I was bitching about have been options on cars for decades before they were forced on everyone.

I also was ASE Master certified and spent a decade in the automotive field.  I also raced stock cars for a few years, have run many passes down drag strips and have road course and auto cross experience.  It appears our backgrounds are similar but opinions are different.

P.S. my wife's aunt has a Sebring convertible with a 2.7 and 150k.  It is undoubtedly one of the few 2.7's I've ever seen go over 100k.  Chryslers are shit but, job security when you are an auto mechanic.

[spenoza]

Car prices have inflated faster than general inflation, partially as a result of all the safety mandates, but on the other hand, newer cars actually have much longer lifespans than older cars (there's a good bit of literature out there on that, so don't give me the old "they don't make 'em like they used to" speech"). And the safety systems have reduced accidents and deaths and major injuries from accidents, which saves the public money since our taxes help subsidize hospital emergency care for those who can't afford it. Nothing drains public health funds like having someone with no health insurance in the hospital with a severed spine.

Truth is, I'm relatively certain on one particular drive through the mountains of West Virginia in a massive rain storm the traction control on a rented SUV saved my life several times (the first time was a real surprise, but after that I altered my driving style dramatically and still had a couple more surprise saves). It was bad enough I had to stop for an hour because visibility from the heavy rain had dropped to zilch.

[Desh]

Car prices have inflated faster than general inflation, partially as a result of all the safety mandates, but on the other hand, newer cars actually have much longer lifespans than older cars (there's a good bit of literature out there on that, so don't give me the old "they don't make 'em like they used to" speech"). And the safety systems have reduced accidents and deaths and major injuries from accidents, which saves the public money since our taxes help subsidize hospital emergency care for those who can't afford it. Nothing drains public health funds like having someone with no health insurance in the hospital with a severed spine.

Truth is, I'm relatively certain on one particular drive through the mountains of West Virginia in a massive rain storm the traction control on a rented SUV saved my life several times (the first time was a real surprise, but after that I altered my driving style dramatically and still had a couple more surprise saves). It was bad enough I had to stop for an hour because visibility from the heavy rain had dropped to zilch.

Everyone has insurance... Obamacare says so.  If you're too poor to pay for insurance then you get a fine you can't afford.

[SignOfZeta]

The fine for ignoring the ACA is %2 of your income with a max of $975. Way way less than insurance if you're in a pay grade above Medcare/Medicaid. If you are totally destitute making $5000 a year (I've been there, believe me) that's $100 so basically you get $100 less of Earned Income Credit when you do your taxes. It's not exactly a motivator. There are still 35M in the US without insurance. Still zero people in the UK without it. Nothing has changed. Viva America.

As for TMPS, the sensors are either gone or on the way out with most cars. My 2014 Jetta Wagon does not have them and that was the final year of a generation they haven't sold in two years. BMWs probably always will because...that's BMW. The system works for sure too since I've seen the light once on the VW already. My 2013 Fit has sensors. Also ugly ass wheels, one of which is slightly bent. I'm not a fan of the sensors at all but I'll deal with it.

The cool thing about the passive system is that you can switch wheels with anything that fits. You have to press a button in the glove box to tell the ECU to learn the new tire OD.

[Necromancer]

If you make $5000 a year you'd be getting a subsidy to cover almost the entire premium, making the insurance (second cheapest silver plan) cost the same as the fine.

As for TPMS, the physical sensors are a bit of a pain and costly, but I don't mind the ones that use the ABS sensors for 'free'.  They've come a long way and work well, unlike the first gen systems that were really only useful for detecting one damaged tire and weren't sophisticated enough to realize that all four tires were under inflated.  Like most safety stuff (abs, traction control, etc.), some implementations will work better than others, but I blame the manufacturer for putting out a shitty system not the gov't.

I'm a bit torn on the backup camera mandate, though.  They're great for seeing behind your mammoth Canyonero, but they're hardly necessary in something like a Corolla or Fit.  Again, it's more of a manufacturer thing, seeing as the cost of the screen and camera (and even nav) is negligible and not the hundreds they try to rape you for.

[TDIRunner]

My 2015 Town & Country does not have sensors in the wheels.  It was an option, but not one that I selected.  The van has the ability to warn my of low tire pressures, but it is going by the wheel speed rather than an actual sensor in the tire, which, like I said earlier, is what I prefer if I have to have some type of TPMS.

[spenoza]

I have fallen in love with the camera. I didn't think I would, but I love it. I can back into parking spaces like a crazed parking parkour expert.

[SignOfZeta]

I have fallen in love with the camera. I didn't think I would, but I love it. I can back into parking spaces like a crazed parking parkour expert.

I have a Honda Fit. I can do that anyway.

My coworker's Fit (newer, but made in Mexico like American cars and VWs so I'm not sure what the point is) actually has not one but two cameras. One is in the usual place, one in the right side mirror. It seems pretty dumb from a car that is extremely easy to see out of and has Dumbo ear sized mirrors but then people love to go overboard.

I guess that's the problem with all cars. Cars are designed to appeal to "new car buyers" and those people are at least %90 total moron. People who buy 2WD Honda Ridgelines and complain about fuel economy, etc. The people who have steered BMW away from "The Ultimate Driving Machine" and towards some of the most useless vehicles ever made. People who buy brand new Kias instead of a year old Toyota for the same price. Dodge Caliber owners. Vettes with automatic transmissions. Those jerks.

As for cameras: let me put it this way. Most cars already have a big LCD now for all the Bluetooth stereo bullshit and you can buy a cheap Android burner for $20 so I can't honestly see these cameras increasing the cost of the car. I don't feel the need for one and I don't really enjoy using the one in my Jetta wagon but I will say this: in the vast majority of cars being made today, if a 3 year old kid was sitting on your back bumper and you didn't have a camera you'd never know he was ever there. It's not legally mandated because it makes parking easier, it's there for safety reasons. This doesn't matter to lot of people until it's too late and regret is a motherf*cker. If you want to know why suicide is so popular, wait until you smear your neighbors kid halfway down your block and then see how you feel about it yourself.