Hucard / SuperCD are NOT the same system...

[StarDust4Ever]

Not trying to sound discriminatory against CDs or against people who only have systems capable of playing Hucards, as I myself collect Hucard only.

I'm going use the Genesis / Megadrive, SegaCD, and 32X as an example. Nobody refers to SegaCD or 32X carts as Genesis or Megadrive games, but each peripheral is treated as it's own system when it comes to collecting. This makes sense to me. Sega fans can collect specifically for whichever sub-system they collect for and when doing trades or sales there is no question as to which game plays on what.

Turbografx / PC Engine doesn't seem to make that distinction as much. It just gets kind of frustrating to read about games or suggestions from various folks and the need to do a Google search to determine it's a SuperCD title after I can't find the title in the No_Intro set on my Everdrive. Further compounding the issue is the packaging at first glance is largely the same, ie jewel cases, and closer inspection is needed to make a determination as to the logo for Hucard or SuperCD.

Maybe I'm just being a gripe by the medium as well as the hardware setups needed to play are very different. I'm kind of old school at heart and long ago determined that cart systems were far more reliable over disc systems. Full disclosure; I don't currently own any 90s CD consoles, although I do have a handful of PS1 games I sometimes play on PS3.

[MNKyDeth]

The US games library on HuCard is so small compared to what was released in Japan. Sure there are good games on the HuCards but nearly all the best were on CD. Even then the US releases were so few compared to Japan it made it almost to the point that you needed the CD-Rom to get everything you could out of this console, imo.

Once the Super System 3.0 came out games started pushing the limits of this console and then the Arcade card hit and it upped the ante even further.

My point is, limiting to HuCard only you are seeing a very very small portion of the games and the abilities of this system. I think "we" in general don't separate the HuCards from CD's so much as most people want to explore everything this console has.

This is my 2c on it.

[StarDust4Ever]

I'm not anti-CD by any means, but with the reliability issues with leaky caps and rotten gears, and the high resale prices of system hardware both US and even Japan, it isn't as accessible to many gamers. I cannot afford one right now. Sega CD and especially 32X had smallish libraries compared to Genesis / Megadrive so they are considerably more niche and less desirable.

Still it isn't unreasonable to argue that the base units by themselves always had a larger install base because they came out earlier. In the case of the Genesis, many gamers ignored the CD and 32X addons thus most devs continued releasing straight Genesis carts.

And the Hucard library (counting Japanese entries) is over like 300 titles or so by itself, comparable in size to the US N64 library but with less filler. So I don't believe there isn't a lot to great stuff to collect for as is. Someday I'll get either a Japanese Duo or one of those briefcase setups to complement my stock US Turbografx (don't know why but the bulky modular nature of the briefcase appeals to me), but for now I don't have the money or the space to add one to my collection.

[Gypsy]

Besides the systems, old cds themselves will have issues if not stored properly. I guess carts do too, but I've encountered way more non-working discs than carts. So there are definitely reliability issues. That said, the library is great. So, emulate if you have to, but there are just so many good games you miss out on by not playing CD games.

As for the topic of the op itself. I did always view Sega CD as a separate system despite the fact that you need a Genesis. Maybe it's because of the duo but I always just kind of viewed all the PCE/Turbo stuff as one library.

[esteban]

Not trying to sound discriminatory against CDs or against people who only have systems capable of playing Hucards, as I myself collect Hucard only.

I'm going use the Genesis / Megadrive, SegaCD, and 32X as an example. Nobody refers to SegaCD or 32X carts as Genesis or Megadrive games, but each peripheral is treated as it's own system when it comes to collecting. This makes sense to me. Sega fans can collect specifically for whichever sub-system they collect for and when doing trades or sales there is no question as to which game plays on what.

Turbografx / PC Engine doesn't seem to make that distinction as much. It just gets kind of frustrating to read about games or suggestions from various folks and the need to do a Google search to determine it's a SuperCD title after I can't find the title in the No_Intro set on my Everdrive. Further compounding the issue is the packaging at first glance is largely the same, ie jewel cases, and closer inspection is needed to make a determination as to the logo for Hucard or SuperCD.

Comrade, all you have to do is take a MOMENT to consult a resource:

http://www.pcedaisakusen.net/2/27/list-games.htm

http://www.pcecp.com         

http://www.pcengine.co.uk

http://www.videogameden.com

...and your problem is solved.




Don't worry, you have plenty of time to explore the CD-ROM library of games in the future.

There are TONS of great HuCARD games to enjoy for now.

Obviously, I am not anti-CD...but I appreciate and respect anyone who is able to give the HuCARD titles an opportunity to shine.

While it is true that IT WOULD BE A CRIME TO IGNORE THE CD GAMES (seriously), there is no need to rush into it! Especially if $$$$ is an issue.

HuCARD 4 Eva.





ADVICE: Some folks are going to harass you ("You MUST get CD naowwwwwwwwwwww!!!!") ... Ignore them. Just tell them that OF COURSE YOU WILL PLAY CD GAMES, but later.

Promise this.

Hold true to it.

And the Lourde of Thunder* will bless your game sessions.








* Available as SCD only. Sorry.

[Gypsy]

Some of my absolute favourites are hucards. Devil Crash, Cadash, Super Star Soldier and Final Soldier. I'm pretty sure Soldier Blade will be on that list once I play it.

[rxmage]

I think for a system that had such small market share, NEC did a decent job transitioning to the all in one Duo.  I think the Duo helped homogenize HuCARDS and CDs into just Turbo games.  Using your example of Sega, they stuck with the Frankenstein mash of parts that was the Genesis/CD/32X that each required its own power adapter and had patch cords going everywhere for too long.  While NEC had their period of doing somewhat the same, I think they moved on to an all in one unit sooner.  When looking at both systems today, the Duo is much more readily available than the Sega CDX or X'Eye units.

I get the finance side of being able to jump in and get a CD unit just because you want it.  But, when you can, I would suggest it.  As stated, great games available.  Like you, I love the PCE briefcase.  That was the direction I wanted to go.  But, I was able to obtain a broken dock and broken CD unit for pretty much nothing.  Fixed both and so, here I am.  As Gypsy stated, emulation is a route to experience CD games...I don't think emulation is the sin that some categorize it into.  Emulation made me decide that I wanted the original hardware. 

But hell, what do I know...I haven't even had a cup of coffee yet this morning, so I am pretty much babbling on.

[bob]

@rx: i am actually surprised the cdx has remained somewhat affordable.  you can still get one for under 200 even on the bay.  for another system that had pretty small manufacturing run, i would think that thing would be closer to 500 by now.  especially considering it marries the genny/CD in such a small footprint.

i paid like 250 for one with a mix of 30 carts and CDs (all loose) just over a year ago.  that was an auction, but even some BINs are still pretty reasonable.  of course, if you NEED that box, price is closer to 400 for some stupid reason.

[rxmage]

Gynt,

There have been so many times I have thought about getting a CDX.  Like you said, for everything that it is, it has a nice small foot print.  The only thing that has stopped me is that I hear mixed things about it having cap issues.  And, from the videos I have seen, it looks like a bear to mess with.  I have a model 2 Genesis/CD unit that I need to fix the CD on...need new laser.  I have been holding off because the gears in it look suspect and I don't want to throw good money after bad.  Might have to pull the trigger on a CDX... would free up a lot of room that that model 2 is taking up.

For $250, sounds like you got a sweet deal on that lot.  The one main reason I like the SegaCD is for Popful Mail.  Now, if there was an English translation for the Turbo...

[bob]

funny you say that about the caps.  i have owned 2 cdx systems over the last 5 years and they have always worked perfect.  never had an issue and i never heard of cap problems with them.  but you are the second person in like 2 weeks to say that to me.  i play it regularly, so maybe that helps?

[rxmage]

funny you say that about the caps.  i have owned 2 cdx systems over the last 5 years and they have always worked perfect.  never had an issue and i never heard of cap problems with them.  but you are the second person in like 2 weeks to say that to me.  i play it regularly, so maybe that helps?

I don't know how accurate the purported cap issue is.  I have watched GameTech US  on some of the repairs he has done on the units and he made mention of it being common.  Now that could be just the common repair he does on them...not necessarily a common issue with the units.  Someday I will have to pull the trigger on one.  But, for now, I think my next acquisition will be a Duo...if I can find one for the right price.

[SignOfZeta]

Basically you're crazy. The PCE was designed from the beginning to have the CD unit. CD is not some failed add-on when it comes to PCE. If you get confused about which hardware you need to run the game then...stare a little bit longer. All that info is on every game case.

HuCARDs are underrated, I %100 agree but most PCE games are Super CDs.

As for the longevity of CDs, bullshit. Nearly without exception CDs last forever. "Not stored properly" is hardly an issue. Don't leave your CDs in a non-climate controlled shed in Arizona. Don't scratch the things. Beyond that sort only abuse they last forever. Don't confuse "the abuse of slobs" with "sensitive to storage". In 23 years of playing Turbo I've encountered the same number of bad HuCARDs as I have CDs, none.

[Gypsy]

As for the longevity of CDs, bullshit. Nearly without exception CDs last forever. "Not stored properly" is hardly an issue. Don't leave your CDs in a non-climate controlled shed in Arizona. Don't scratch the things. Beyond that sort only abuse they last forever. Don't confuse "the abuse of slobs" with "sensitive to storage". In 23 years of playing Turbo I've encountered the same number of bad HuCARDs as I have CDs, none.

Fair point. I've never had an issue with a disc I've bought that worked when I bought it. People always seem to bitch about it, but they are likely abusing the discs. I don't think disc rot is a serious issue (outside of LDs, obviously) as I have had a bunch of old discs for a long time and none of them have shown any signs of that.

[elmer]

The PCE was designed from the beginning to have the CD unit. CD is not some failed add-on when it comes to PCE.

Yep, that's right. The CD was part of the PCE's initial design.

You can see how very little hardware it actually adds to the system ... just the drive and the ADPCM and some RAM, all addressed by the main PCE CPU.

Nothing on the PCE is actually "replaced" when you add the briefcase to the base PCE.

Compare that to Sega's MegaCD which was never a part of the original Genesis.

It's a horrible kludge, and is basically a totally separate console that does its own game processing on its own internal CPU/RAM/blitter and then shuts down the original Genesis CPU so that the MegaCD can DMA the resulting image to the Genesis's VDC to be displayed.

It's a "clever" solution to getting increased performance out of the awful Genesis design limitations ... but it's an ugly, ugly hack.

The same with the 32x and its nest of wires.

They're both really different machines to the original console, just sold as add-ons rather than new systems.

[esteban]

Some of my absolute favourites are hucards. Devil Crash, Cadash, Super Star Soldier and Final Soldier. I'm pretty sure Soldier Blade will be on that list once I play it.

Yes, Soldier Blade will be on the short list.