Analyzing Street Fighter 2: CE on why it is so great.

[spenoza]

About the 68000, according to Wikipedia it's a CISC chip, 16-bit design with many 32-bit registers. Feeding data to 32-bit registers normally requires it be 32-bit data, which should be relatively large if code size is indeed not inconsequential. I know later 680x0 chips were true 32 bit, but the 68000 appears to be something of a bridge or crossover chip, being the first in the series and all. I've always been a little confused by that because the 68030 and on were 32-bit in and out, and early Macintosh code that ran on the 68000-based Macs was 32-bit code and ran fine on the later CPUs. I'm sure, of course, OS support played a role and I doubt the early stuff was written all in assembly, but the "bitness" of the original 68000 has always been a confusing issue.

[BonkThis]

I love the examples black tiger, is there any chance you can throw up the arcade equivalent next to the 3 you already have for the ultimate comparrison?

[PhilBiker]

Click here for Genesis voice examples recorded from real hardware by me.

Click here for TurboGrafx voice examples from Black Tiger (I assume from real hardware).

You need to add some samples from the original "Fighting Street" and "Forgotten Worlds" to that TG16/PCE example.  Both Capcom and those have to be the absolute WORST!  "What strength but don't forget there are many guys like you all over the world!".

[spenoza]

I don't remember those Dynamite Headdy sample sounding so high quality on an actual console, or even in an emulator. What's up with that?

[nat]

Click here for Genesis voice examples recorded from real hardware by me.

Click here for TurboGrafx voice examples from Black Tiger (I assume from real hardware).

You need to add some samples from the original "Fighting Street" and "Forgotten Worlds" to that TG16/PCE example.  Both Capcom and those have to be the absolute WORST!  "What strength but don't forget there are many guys like you all over the world!".

The voice clips in Forgotten Worlds are f*cking hilarious. I laugh every time I play the game (I played it last night so they're fresh on my mind). They never get old, I swear.

"Did you find the guy?"
"I'll finish you today for sure!"
"You cannot finish me with Paramecium alone!"

 

It's obviously the same guy changing the tone of his voice for each of the characaters. Does anyone know if those clips are lifted straight out of the arcade? Obviously a Turbo CD game is capable of so much more, but those FW clips are so horribly awesome I wouldn't have it any other way. Truly a video game classic...

[Joe Redifer]

The voices in Fighting Street and Forgotten Worlds rock, but those are not TG-16 voice examples.  The ADPCM does those (and they are exactly like the arcades sound).

I don't remember those Dynamite Headdy sample sounding so high quality on an actual console, or even in an emulator. What's up with that?

There are two possibilities:

#1 - You remember incorrectly.  This is the most likely scenario.

#2 - You listened to them on a crappy Genesis 2 (the ones with the messed up sound) or a poorly written emulator which made the voices somehow sound worse.  I haven't seen too many emulators that could play Space Harrier II's "Get Ready" voice correctly.  It usually sounds slowed-down.

[awack]

The JP version of forgotten worlds has an option to change the voices not only does it effect the cutscenes but also in game when you get hit or die it longer sounds as if some one is smashing there face on a microphone.

[Joe Redifer]

The sound team at Capcom is very poor.  There was lots of popping in Street Fighter as well (that's what the distortion is called when you hear the puff of air from the letter "p", etc), not to mention other sorts of distortion from being too close to the mic.  Forgotten Worlds has a lot of this and Strider even has a little bit.  Totally unprofessional recordings.

[Black Tiger]

I love the examples black tiger, is there any chance you can throw up the arcade equivalent next to the 3 you already have for the ultimate comparrison?

Here are some of the 4-way shots I've got ready-



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I've got screenshots of all the stages of all four versions.

Click here for Genesis voice examples recorded from real hardware by me.

Click here for TurboGrafx voice examples from Black Tiger (I assume from real hardware).

Yeah those were recorded from real actual hardware, but they are only some of the english samples that I could find on HuCards that I actually own(and I'm no HuCard game expert).

Even though most HuCard games are kept small or moved to CD, there're probably better samples on HuCards. But I don't think that anything would sound better than the best of those Genesis samples.

That's right!  Two white guys cannot possibly hate each other, so no special treatment for that victim!

Anyway I think the Genesis voices sound bad because there is only one DAC in the thing.  The game had to be able to play back more than one voice at a time, which it often does.  Also you have sampled drums and elephant screeches.  The sample rate was probably halved if not quartered to accomplish this through a single channel.

If thats the case, they shouldn't have bothered trying to get so many simultaneous sampled sfx going at once. It looks like the PCE version only uses 2 channels for samples, one for voices and one for sfx & instruments and it sounds fine multiple sfx-wise. The arcade doesn't even have more than one voice at once.

Maybe multi-channel samples are a strength the PCE has against the Genesis' seemingly better potential quality for single samples.

[awack]

It seems that the snes and genesis versions are missing the dude with the guitar in the second set of pics.

[Black Tiger]

It seems that the snes and genesis versions are missing the dude with the guitar in the second set of pics.

Yeah, each port has its own unique inclusions or ommissions. The MD/Gen version seems to have the most of those touches in its bgs.

Some ports are more faithful in color to the arcade in some areas of stages while some are different but look nicer.

[SNKNostalgia]

I think they just simply spent a lot more time on the PCE version. Think about it, they had to make a 16-bit game work right for a 8-bit system with 16-bit color. Also, it probably helped that the PCE was already being maxed out in those days. It wasn't until 95-96 when the SNES and Genesis did some really amazing stuff with the help of more experience and higher meg counts.

Another missing thing is the girl to the left of the jet intake in Guiles stage. Also, the Vegas girls are bouncy on the PCE but not SNES and even more bouncy on the arcade. I have an eye for that after being a KOF fan for years.

[spenoza]

Joe, please PM me some info (and sites) about the "crappy Genesis 2". That's the model I have and I'd like to find out more so I can replace it, if need be.

[Black Tiger]

I think they just simply spent a lot more time on the PCE version. Think about it, they had to make a 16-bit game work right for a 8-bit system with 16-bit color. Also, it probably helped that the PCE was already being maxed out in those days. It wasn't until 95-96 when the SNES and Genesis did some really amazing stuff with the help of more experience and higher meg counts.

Another missing thing is the girl to the left of the jet intake in Guiles stage. Also, the Vegas girls are bouncy on the PCE but not SNES and even more bouncy on the arcade. I have an eye for that after being a KOF fan for years.

I actually think that Capcom did a half-assed job compared to the standard of their SNES ports. Sure it turned out great, but it should've been a lot better.

Around the time that the PCE version was near completion, Capcom showed off its Megadrive version of 'CE which would've been released around the same time. It was definitely a rushed straight port. The color was awful, its was severly letterboxed, had smaller sprites and real slowdown. It showed that Capcom really didn't care about its non-Nintendo games.

Luckily, the negative reaction and likely a mathematicion showing them what the Sega market was like outside of Japan convinced them to go back to the drawing board at the last minute. The huge jump in quality of the 'Special Champion Edition" really impressed me when it finally came out. Especially Guile's stage.

I've been dying to find a rom of some footage of that original Megadrive SFIICE port, but the closest I've ever come is of the second attempt that resembles the final version more. It does seem to have different music than the final version and some FM sfx though.

Capcom never made any other PCE games before or after and it was only a contract job that NEC hired them to do. Plus, as it was being developed the mags reported how NEC wanted the game out asap, to bask in exclusivity before the other versions got released. Because at that point, the only other home version was SNES WW.

At the very least they music should've been programmed/performed like some of the better HuCard soundtracks, the black bar behind the HP bars is unnecessary and it wouldn't be hard to do at least some layered bgs/scrolling. One of the good NEC Ave teams could've done a much better job.

If Capcom had at least made as many games for PCE as Konami did and was publishing them themselves, I think that the game would be a lot different(especially if it was a port of the arcade instead of the SNES WW).

[SNKNostalgia]

I remember my friends that all had Genesis 2 systems with some similar faults and some different. All except 1 of them had a graphical barring effect going vertical across the screen, which is very noticeable in solid BGs. Two of them had not so great sound, especially noticed it when my friend was playing Mortal Kombat 2 once.