The Light Gray "TurboGrafx System."

[Joe Redifer]

The only difference is a crystal on the board which is rated at a different clock speed, so that the video output will be 50Hz instead of 60 (that's all it takes for PAL output - no need for "signal conversion").

WRONG!  PAL color is completely different than NTSC color.  It's not just the speed difference.  If you only slowed it down to 50Hz, you'd have NTSC 50 which is not PAL.  Just like PAL 60 is not NTSC.

Because while games generally run somewhat slower (constantly, not just occasionally, which slowdown means), the frame rates are actually higher. It's a little hard to explain

I bet it is, especially since games that usually run at 60fps could never be bested in framerate by those that run at 50fps.  Perhaps you mean there is less slowdown and when it happens it is less severe as a result.  That I will buy.

[Game and Watch Kirby]

It's orange and yellow, not red and yellow.  Candy corn, which is undoubtedly a Halloween candy, is also orange and yellow; therefor a orange and yellow motif on a black object (nobody can intelligently argue that black is unHalloweeny), can certainly be considered a Halloween theme.

Supposedly, in certain lightings, the "Turbo" part of the logo can appear to be orange. From the many image sources I've seen before, this has been red.

Are you daft? Its not red, its orange.

Again, that was based on my image sources. What I can say is that the "Turbo" part is a darker color than the "16" circle. It may just be considered, then, a red-orange :!:.

[Turbo D]

Well, I happen to have the console sitting right in front of me. Its not red-orange, its just orange. Perhaps you should find new image sources 

[Game and Watch Kirby]

Well, I happen to have the console sitting right in front of me. Its not red-orange, its just orange. Perhaps you should find new image sources 

Okay then, but I'm not going to say that what I've seen is inaccurate, either. Until I can get true hard-core evidence (such as seeing one in real life), I will let this stand by. This may be the type of thing that's related to how PlayStations can look like a darker gray in certain lighting conditions.

[Necromancer]

Okay then, but I'm not going to say that what I've seen is inaccurate, either. Until I can get true hard-core evidence (such as seeing one in real life), I will let this stand by. This may be the type of thing that's related to how PlayStations can look like a darker gray in certain lighting conditions.

So the images that you've seen on the internet lead you to believe that it's red, and the fellow board members (who actually own the hardware in question) can't convince you that it's orange.  Fine, then I say that PS3s are titty pink.  I overheard a blind hobo muttering something to this effect, and since I don't have one sitting in front of me to disprove this theory, then it must be true. 

Just yanking your chain a bit.  Go back to Black Tiger's pic of the Euro and US controllers.  Under identical lighting conditions, it clearly shows the orange/yellow coloring of the US controller and the red/blue coloring of the Euro controller.

[Black Tiger]

It's orange and yellow, not red and yellow.  Candy corn, which is undoubtedly a Halloween candy, is also orange and yellow; therefor a orange and yellow motif on a black object (nobody can intelligently argue that black is unHalloweeny), can certainly be considered a Halloween theme.

Supposedly, in certain lightings, the "Turbo" part of the logo can appear to be orange. From the many image sources I've seen before, this has been red.

Are you daft? Its not red, its orange.

I don't think that Game and Watch Kirby has spent much time with a TG-16 in person and is judging from various online pics, many of which can be misleading.

The only difference is a crystal on the board which is rated at a different clock speed, so that the video output will be 50Hz instead of 60 (that's all it takes for PAL output - no need for "signal conversion").

WRONG!  PAL color is completely different than NTSC color.  It's not just the speed difference.  If you only slowed it down to 50Hz, you'd have NTSC 50 which is not PAL.  Just like PAL 60 is not NTSC.

Because while games generally run somewhat slower (constantly, not just occasionally, which slowdown means), the frame rates are actually higher. It's a little hard to explain

I bet it is, especially since games that usually run at 60fps could never be bested in framerate by those that run at 50fps.  Perhaps you mean there is less slowdown and when it happens it is less severe as a result.  That I will buy.

I think Seldane is talking about playing games made/converted/localized/optimized for PAL consoles and then switching to 60Hz.

Well, I happen to have the console sitting right in front of me. Its not red-orange, its just orange. Perhaps you should find new image sources 

Okay then, but I'm not going to say that what I've seen is inaccurate, either. Until I can get true hard-core evidence (such as seeing one in real life), I will let this stand by. This may be the type of thing that's related to how PlayStations can look like a darker gray in certain lighting conditions.

The problem is that the TG-16's orange is fluorescent and shiny and doesn't always appear in photos as it looks in person.

[Joe Redifer]

I think Seldane is talking about playing games made/converted/localized/optimized for PAL consoles and then switching to 60Hz.

Then the games would run too fast.

[Black Tiger]

I think Seldane is talking about playing games made/converted/localized/optimized for PAL consoles and then switching to 60Hz.

Then the games would run too fast.

Thats what I would also assume, but judging from his post, it sounds like he sits next to his console and flicks the Hz switch back and forth as he encounters slowdown in games.

[Game and Watch Kirby]

It's orange and yellow, not red and yellow.  Candy corn, which is undoubtedly a Halloween candy, is also orange and yellow; therefor a orange and yellow motif on a black object (nobody can intelligently argue that black is unHalloweeny), can certainly be considered a Halloween theme.

Supposedly, in certain lightings, the "Turbo" part of the logo can appear to be orange. From the many image sources I've seen before, this has been red.

Are you daft? Its not red, its orange.

I don't think that Game and Watch Kirby has spent much time with a TG-16 in person and is judging from various online pics, many of which can be misleading.

The only difference is a crystal on the board which is rated at a different clock speed, so that the video output will be 50Hz instead of 60 (that's all it takes for PAL output - no need for "signal conversion").

WRONG!  PAL color is completely different than NTSC color.  It's not just the speed difference.  If you only slowed it down to 50Hz, you'd have NTSC 50 which is not PAL.  Just like PAL 60 is not NTSC.

Because while games generally run somewhat slower (constantly, not just occasionally, which slowdown means), the frame rates are actually higher. It's a little hard to explain

I bet it is, especially since games that usually run at 60fps could never be bested in framerate by those that run at 50fps.  Perhaps you mean there is less slowdown and when it happens it is less severe as a result.  That I will buy.

I think Seldane is talking about playing games made/converted/localized/optimized for PAL consoles and then switching to 60Hz.

Well, I happen to have the console sitting right in front of me. Its not red-orange, its just orange. Perhaps you should find new image sources 

Okay then, but I'm not going to say that what I've seen is inaccurate, either. Until I can get true hard-core evidence (such as seeing one in real life), I will let this stand by. This may be the type of thing that's related to how PlayStations can look like a darker gray in certain lighting conditions.

The problem is that the TG-16's orange is fluorescent and shiny and doesn't always appear in photos as it looks in person.

I did a few anglings with a couple of pictures of TurboGrafx-16s (I have an LCD monitor for my computer). When viewing the screen from down below, when the screen turns black and inversed for lighted liquid crystal display screens, the "Turbo" part of the logo looks to be more of a reddish color. When viewing it from above, it looks to be a light orange. The "16" circle part, however, was virtually the same. Now, I know that PlayStations can look a darker gray in certain lighting, specifically dim ones, since I have one, but if it is as fluorescent orange and can look different in photos as said, maybe it's possible that the same event can happen with that part of the logo. Even still, I consider it more of an "evil" color scheme since yellow doesn't strongly fit with Halloween (only black and orange are greatly this, and candy corn is yellow, orange, and white, also).

[SignOfZeta]

...someone please explain the difference in 50mA. That's a considerable power difference.

No, it really isn't. Not when you consider than a PCE needs ten times that just to function without problems.

[Turbo D]

It's orange and yellow, not red and yellow.  Candy corn, which is undoubtedly a Halloween candy, is also orange and yellow; therefor a orange and yellow motif on a black object (nobody can intelligently argue that black is unHalloweeny), can certainly be considered a Halloween theme.

Supposedly, in certain lightings, the "Turbo" part of the logo can appear to be orange. From the many image sources I've seen before, this has been red.

Are you daft? Its not red, its orange.

I don't think that Game and Watch Kirby has spent much time with a TG-16 in person and is judging from various online pics, many of which can be misleading.

The only difference is a crystal on the board which is rated at a different clock speed, so that the video output will be 50Hz instead of 60 (that's all it takes for PAL output - no need for "signal conversion").

WRONG!  PAL color is completely different than NTSC color.  It's not just the speed difference.  If you only slowed it down to 50Hz, you'd have NTSC 50 which is not PAL.  Just like PAL 60 is not NTSC.

Because while games generally run somewhat slower (constantly, not just occasionally, which slowdown means), the frame rates are actually higher. It's a little hard to explain

I bet it is, especially since games that usually run at 60fps could never be bested in framerate by those that run at 50fps.  Perhaps you mean there is less slowdown and when it happens it is less severe as a result.  That I will buy.

I think Seldane is talking about playing games made/converted/localized/optimized for PAL consoles and then switching to 60Hz.

Well, I happen to have the console sitting right in front of me. Its not red-orange, its just orange. Perhaps you should find new image sources 

Okay then, but I'm not going to say that what I've seen is inaccurate, either. Until I can get true hard-core evidence (such as seeing one in real life), I will let this stand by. This may be the type of thing that's related to how PlayStations can look like a darker gray in certain lighting conditions.

The problem is that the TG-16's orange is fluorescent and shiny and doesn't always appear in photos as it looks in person.

I did a few anglings with a couple of pictures of TurboGrafx-16s (I have an LCD monitor for my computer). When viewing the screen from down below, when the screen turns black and inversed for lighted liquid crystal display screens, the "Turbo" part of the logo looks to be more of a reddish color. When viewing it from above, it looks to be a light orange. The "16" circle part, however, was virtually the same. Now, I know that PlayStations can look a darker gray in certain lighting, specifically dim ones, since I have one, but if it is as fluorescent orange and can look different in photos as said, maybe it's possible that the same event can happen with that part of the logo. Even still, I consider it more of an "evil" color scheme since yellow doesn't strongly fit with Halloween (only black and orange are greatly this, and candy corn is yellow, orange, and white, also).

[FM-77]

No such thing.

Could have chosen a better way to say it...makes ya sound rude. Anyways, I've never looked in one so I wouldn't know...only going by what others have said, and what makes sense. So then, if there's no video conversion circuitry...someone please explain the difference in 50mA. That's a considerable power difference.

Sorry dood. I didn't know that it made me sound rude. I didn't intend to.

I bet it is, especially since games that usually run at 60fps could never be bested in framerate by those that run at 50fps.  Perhaps you mean there is less slowdown and when it happens it is less severe as a result.  That I will buy.

There's a major difference in 60Hz and 60FPS. 60Hz is how often the TV updates the frame, 60FPS is how many frames the hardware actually deliver. The TV will always update the frame at 50 or 60 times, depending on the video mode, but the hardware will NEVER deliver a solid 50 or 60 FPS. In PAL mode, the hardware is somehow capable of delivering more FPS, which is evident in PAL machines where frame rate drops are far fewer than on their NTSC counterparts.

PS: I did not mean games optimized for 50Hz. Those games are REALLY rare. The only ones I can think of are SMW and Donkey Kong Country 1-3 for SNES. Pretty much all other games run 17% slower in 50Hz mode. It's very fun to play those games in 60Hz mode, since that makes them run far faster than they are intended to. It's kinda like Sonic, except it's Mario/DK. SMW gets some graphical glitches when you do this, though.

I will try to record a video of me switching from 60 to 50 Hz on a certain boss battle in Light Crusader where there's a massive FPS drop in NTSC mode, but almost none in PAL mode.

And about the PAL/NTSC color thing... I really think it depends on the TV alone, not the console. A PAL TV will always display PAL video, regardless if the console is a NTSC variant or not, or if the video mode is 50 or 60 Hz.

[nodtveidt]

Sorry dood. I didn't know that it made me sound rude. I didn't intend to.

No problem. A better way to say it would have been "There actually is no converter" or "Whoever told you it had a converter is a monkey snot".

[Joe Redifer]

60Hz is how often the TV updates the frame, 60FPS is how many frames the hardware actually deliver. The TV will always update the frame at 50 or 60 times, depending on the video mode, but the hardware will NEVER deliver a solid 50 or 60 FPS.

Wow.  Just wow.  Have you never seen a game scroll?  Most games scroll at 60fps.  That's right, it's in a different position 59.94 times per second (the TV actually runs at 59.94Hz).  Some games like Wonderboy 3 on the SMS, scroll at 30fps (rounded up from 29.97).  The Turbo/PCE version of the same game scrolls much smoother at 60fps. 

Can YOU tell the difference between 30fps and 60fps?  Try and see if you can tell me which of these identical clips is a solid 60fps and which is a solid 30fps.  It is from Super Monkey Ball which runs at 60fps and never, ever drops a frame

Quicktime format - 1.86 MB

WMV format - 2.16 MB

Note: If your computer is slow/ancient, you may have trouble playing back the file without it stuttering.  In this case the results would be inconclusive to you.

[nodtveidt]

As a game designer, I can ALWAYS tell the difference between 30fps and 60fps. It's almost a no-brainer. Frame-based timing is my specialty, despite my PC-developing colleagues constantly telling me "time-based movement is superior!".