Turbo Gouging on Ebay ( r.i.p. - gouging much )

[Necromancer]

I guess I'll take that as "apology not accept."

Sure it's accepted, though hardly necessary; I thought it was a mostly civil discussion, and my last message was merely me explaining my reasoning.  Is this a topic that can't be discussed at all?

Opinions vary: some peeps here think that any dealings on eBay are part of the problem, some think it's all supply and demand, some (like me) are somewhere between the two, and some simply don't give a shit.

[SMF]

WAIT YOU MEAN KEITH COURAGE AIN'T WORTH $80? Crap and here I've been buying up all these copys to resell and retire in a year ;-)

[Sadler]

As I've learned the hard way at work many times, it can be difficult to read emotion over text. I certainly don't want to step on any toes and I don't want to clog up your thread with a slap fight. I do understand where you are coming from, though we clearly don't agree on all points.

I'm more than willing to continue the discussion if you'd like. I promise to leave the "f*ck you"s out of it this time. I really am curious about some of the questions I asked you earlier, just to get a better read on what your comfort level for purchasing a game is. Are there titles you are still looking for? How long are you willing to wait for them? What would you be willing to pay for them?

If you'd rather spin off a different thread, that's cool too.

[Mathius]

Patience is definitely a virtue. For example, when I finally acquired my copy of Beyond Shadowgate a few months ago I didn't pay nearly what it goes for on eBay. I ended up trading a semi common game, an Alien Crush box, and a little bit of $$.

[Necromancer]

I promise to leave the "f*ck you"s out of it this time.

We can save 'em for those that really deserve it.  Like the French.

Are there titles you are still looking for?

Essentially, anything I don't already have.  Of the pricey titles ($100+), methinks the only ones I don't have yet are Dynastic Hero, Super Air Zonk, and Magical Chase.

How long are you willing to wait for them?

'Til the cows come home.

What would you be willing to pay for them?

For most games, I consider anything at the low end of eBay prices to be fair, but that doesn't work too well for less common games, like the above three.  Off hand I couldn't say how much I'd pay for one of those today, but it certainly wouldn't be as much as the recent high BIN prices.

If you'd rather spin off a different thread, that's cool too.

Nah, discussing what we consider a gouge job to be is pretty close to the topic.

[Damon Plus]

Patience is definitely a virtue. For example, when I finally acquired my copy of Beyond Shadowgate a few months ago I didn't pay nearly what it goes for on eBay. I ended up trading a semi common game, an Alien Crush box, and a little bit of $$.

Something similar happened to me, altough not quite on the same scale. Instead of buying the Alien Crush I saw at 20€ I waited for a better deal. Just 2 months later, I got Alien Crush, World Class Baseball and Power Golf, all 3, unopened, for 15€.

[RoyVegas]

Aside from witnessing Royvegas blantantly ripping off memebrs last year and selling implode all that, i think we all get along well great and thats what makes this community so tight and awesome imo.

While people may have not liked my pricing on my collection that I sold, I never ripped off anyone on this forum or anywhere else.  If you have any proof of me "ripping anyone off" please provide it.

[BigT]

Dynastic Hero.

Before I go on, let me make it abundantly clear: I like you Necro, as well as just about everyone on this board. You guys are great people, very knowledgeable, and always willing to help fellow turbo fans. I truly appreciate it.

Now, having said that, I'm feeling cranky, let's hash this out again. Could you spend every waking moment scouring garage sales, flea markets and craigslist hoping you you find a copy of Dyanstic Hero for $0.50? Yeah. Could you hope to run across a misspelled copy with a BIN of $50 that lasts for 15 seconds? Sure. Are those realistic ways to find these rare games? No. Not at all, and I think you are kidding yourself if you believe that. I don't care that some of you found Magical Chase 6 years ago for $5. Congrats. That isn't the common case. So what are we really looking at here? Supply vs demand. Obviously there are people willing to pay these prices. Do I think an $80 Keith Courage is stupid? Of course! If there were copies of Dynastic Hero on ebay every day for $50, then $600 would be stupid. There aren't. $500-600 for that game is common. This isn't a "problem," it's the realities of economics. I'm sorry if some of you can't afford a $2000 Magical Chase. Honestly, right now I can't either. But I'm not going to condemn someone as "destroying the turbo market" if they pay that. They have the money to afford it, they want it, and that's fine. 

Seriously, you want to play these games cheaply? You've got 3 options: a) Buy it on Wii VC, b) Buy a PC Engine version or c) play it on emulators. Have to have a physical copy of the US version? Then pay the going rate. I've done it all ways. Now I want a complete US collection. Out of maybe 130 US titles I own, I think there's only 3 I've paid more than $100 for.

I'm not interested in destroying anything turbo related. I support homebrew. I offer to mail around memorabilia for free. Shit, I'll give away sealed copies of TV Sports games (sorry, that's all I've got duplicates of) to anyone that needs them. But if I want to spend my hard earned money on something, then that's my deal.

I agree with the above.

People have the right to list a game on ebay for whatever they want and similarly people have the right to pay whatever they want.

For some people, time happens to be a more precious commodity than money... I still (as a holdover from times when I was a poor student) probably tend to spend way too much time attempting to get good deals.  Now with a job and more personal responsibilities, it would probably serve me better to spend more money and gain more time... I could probably just pick up an extra shift at work and make up the difference... while overall spending less time... but it's a hard habit to break... still refreshing ebay trying to catch that $15 BIN "Magikal Chaze" 

[Black Tiger]

Magical Chase is purchased for $5 much more often than it is at $5000 - $10000, or rare NES Sports games selling for $30000 - $50000.

None of the people saying that games can be found at reasonable prices is saying that the games are only worth the least they have ever sold for. It's only pro-record high selling prices people who are claiming that games are worth every bit as much as anyone has possibly sold them for.

 "Possibly " because record highs on eBay arent an indication of an actual sale or intention. Aside from all the fake bidding and fake selling that goes on with eBay, market manipulators who buy every game up to a certain price with the sole intention of controlling the market arent buying games as games nor games as collectibles based on what they value them for or even what they think that others value them at. They are doing something outside of all that and itscthese artificial spikes mixed in with genuine purchasing that throw off people who collect games they arent familiar with or care what their actual "values" might be. Their understanding of the market starts and ends with the recent history, or worse, the current asking prices of games on eBay.

Those people alone support the others manipulating the market. People who say that finding games for less is complete fantasy are free to continue paying whatever they feel that they must. But they can't change the reality of the rest of us who ARE actually finding all these games for less. It will continue to be b.s. to you, but for the rest of us it is really happening and you can't change that.

[BlueBMW]

Case in point....  a few weeks ago a copy of beyond shadowgate sold for $400+... just today another similar copy sold for just over $200...  so what is Beyond Shadowgate really worth?  Ill bet the second seller was expecting to get $400 for his/her copy just like the other guy (of whom there is some suspicion of shilling etc)

[Black Tiger]

I also find it humorous when pro-high selling price people, who often literally say "good for them" about someone selling a game for the most that they can get ("it's their right!"), no matter how cheap they got it for... -ask the rest of us where they can find all the cheap games ("prove it!"). 

Roy may not have ripped anyone off, but people like him have made it harder for you guys, especially those who want to jump into a community and instantly reap all the benefits.

Also, many of us who make the biggest argument against high prices = absolute value, arent cheapskates. We actually spend hundreds of dollars on single game related items.

All that you are buying when you pay a high+ price for a game is time. A fraction of that purchase of time is the actual game. I might have bought Magical Chase and Cotton new for $5 each, but I also paid over $100 each for Golden Axe, Super Darius and Side Arms Special. I also spent over $1200 to aquire my first Turbo CD. I couldn't be happier with those purchases. Instead of waiting until I found them cheap, I paid a premium to have them as soon as possible. The difference between myself and modern price-based collectors, is that I don't fool myself about what I'm really paying for.

As gross as it is when I hear people say that their overpriced purchase is "an investment", and they are supporting price jacking on purpose... It only makes me wonder why these financial geniuses even bother with game collecting, since their stashes of Beanie Babies and Pogs should be security enough for their future.

[JapanTokei]

BlackTiger!  been a while since I saw ya on the boards...

I agree, the most important thing is for people to not just pickup the games for "investment" purposes, if they have no intention of playing/collecting them, rather just to resale them later.  If that's the case, move onto the stock market !   

[GameFreak]

Some deals I got recently Im happy with....
I got Toilet Kids on ebay for $25 and STRIP Fighter for $18. The games didnt have manuals but the price was  amazing. There is a complete copy of STRIP Fighter II on ebay now for $240, no thanks! And Toilet kids goes for about 70-140 on ebay, no thanks. Also I got an Arcade Card Pro for $24 which isn't too bad. If you are patient you can still score deals on ebay!!!

Also recently I found a turbo grafx 16 with the cd attachment in a small "mom and pop" gamestore. It had one loose hu card (r-type) but no cd games or system card. The owner said he was selling it cheap since he had no way to test the cd unit. I popped in a music cd to see if the laser works, which it did. So I bought it for the asking price of $42 !!!

So for about $110 total I got Toilet Kids, Strip Fighter, R-type, Arcade Card PRO, and a turbo grafx16 complete cd system setup.
It's actually been a good year!

[Necromancer]

While people may have not liked my pricing on my collection that I sold, I never ripped off anyone on this forum or anywhere else.  If you have any proof of me "ripping anyone off" please provide it.

"Ripoff" does not equal "scam".  As you say, some cared not for your prices, and one definition for ripoff is 'paying more than something is worth'. 

[Sadler]

We can save 'em for those that really deserve it.  Like the French.

Deal.

Essentially, anything I don't already have.  Of the pricey titles ($100+), methinks the only ones I don't have yet are Dynastic Hero, Super Air Zonk, and Magical Chase.

Sounds like our goals are the same. This does bring up the question of what games you believe are $100+ titles. Here are the titles I'm missing (no, I don't care about Bikini Girls or whatever, nor different colored Champions Forever-at least not for now ):

Beyond Shadowgate
Bonk 3
Cotton
Legend Of Hero Tonma
Magical Chase
Might And Magic 3
Soldier Blade
Super Air Zonk
Terraforming

Note that pretty much every one of those titles are generally considered expensive, I started with the cheap games. I don't think I'd be upset to pay more than $100 for any of those, though I'm harboring hope that I'll find a loose Bonk 3 for less. Several of those I full expect to pay more than $200 for. Magical Chase is the only one on the list I'd pay $500 or more for.

'Til the cows come home.

I think this is the major area we disagree on, but maybe I should give a bit of context. First, prices are dynamic and with few exceptions they don't tend to get cheaper. Even in the 2 years I've been trying to collect, prices have jumped quite a bit (perhaps due to my own actions). However, it seems safe to guess that the longer I wait, the more I'm likely to pay for a given game. Moreover, I do have a decent job right now and due to the unfortunate death of my grandmother back in March, I've got some extra savings.

To put some time frame on it, I'd like to finish off my collection sometime in the next couple years. I certainly don't want to wait indefinitely to complete my collection. I fully expect Magical Chase to be the last title I buy and I don't expect it to be cheap.

For most games, I consider anything at the low end of eBay prices to be fair, but that doesn't work too well for less common games, like the above three.  Off hand I couldn't say how much I'd pay for one of those today, but it certainly wouldn't be as much as the recent high BIN prices.

Cop out! That's cool, I'm sure it depends on any number of environmentally dependent variables.