Sound Emulation - PCE vs EMU

[spenoza]

Well, most people complain about HES emulation over-emphasizing the noise channel (thus the percussion), so I'm tempted to choose the odd sounding one as the actual hardware, but that's too easy, so I plugged my Core into the TV and broke out The Kung Fu. Over the puny mono speakers of my TV the noise channel is actually pretty strong (almost dominant, just like the emulators). I also just tested the ROM in Ootake, on all three different modes of PSG filtering.

The 3rd recording is the odd one out and is definitely not original hardware or any of Ootake's PSG modes. I would guess Magic Engine because I think it has the least accurate sound emulation, but I don't know for sure.

The first, second, and fourth recordings all sound pretty similar, actually. It's difficult, at least from the recording, to make out any significant differences between them. I'm not comfortable guessing which is which. I would say that PCE PSG emulation is currently sufficiently accurate that you'd need good equipment and even better ears to really have reason to complain.

It also makes me wonder why anyone would bother, any longer, to pay money for Magic Engine, with such excellent free alternatives available. Yeah, the UI is nice, but it's also custom and doesn't make use of any of the common Windows widgets, which is rather pointless these days.

*edit*
Also, since I'm using a Core I, does that mean I have the "more awesomer" sound hardware that the SGFX supposedly uses?

[sunteam_paul]

 How about at least posting what version # of the emulators you used, also what real system you used as well. I'm pretty sure I know what the real system is. One of the recordings sound very wrong in the opening part. Not sure what EMU it is, though.

I just checked and one of the emulators I used was a little out of date. For fairness, I have re-recorded it and uploaded it again. You may or may not notice any difference:

THE KUNG FU (again)

I'll list what was where when people have had some more time to listen, discuss and guess what is what.

[spenoza]

Either there's a lack of ability to really distinguish most of these, or there's a whole lot of apathy about this topic.

[sunteam_paul]

OK, here's the listing in order *drum roll*:

1. Mednafen

2. A real PC Engine Duo-RX

3. Ootake

4. Magic Engine

[spenoza]

What settings did you use on Ootake when you recorded that? I ask because I checked with the latest version (just downloaded it) and it doesn't sound like your recording.

[sunteam_paul]

What settings did you use on Ootake when you recorded that? I ask because I checked with the latest version (just downloaded it) and it doesn't sound like your recording.

Defaults, also freshly downloaded.

The only thing I have done with the emulated sounds is to drop the treble to better match the output from the hardware.

[spenoza]

I think that partially explains it. By default, Ootake does some weird "high quality PSG" stuff which reduces the treble a little. In fact, the mixing on Ootake overall is a little light on treble. If you further knocked off some treble that would definitely skew the results a little. I tried changing the PSG settings in Ootake but even on the lightest setting it's still a hair low in the treble department.

Interesting. I hadn't noticed this effect at all until you created this recording. It's also interesting, because I still find I like the way it sounds and find it to be very close to the sound of my PCE Core connected to my TV. I know the author of Ootake will take emails about his emulator. I'm tempted to send him a link to the audio file and see what he thinks.

[nat]

What settings did you use on Ootake when you recorded that? I ask because I checked with the latest version (just downloaded it) and it doesn't sound like your recording.

Defaults, also freshly downloaded.

The only thing I have done with the emulated sounds is to drop the treble to better match the output from the hardware.

Doesn't that partially defeat the purpose of the comparison?

[sunteam_paul]

What settings did you use on Ootake when you recorded that? I ask because I checked with the latest version (just downloaded it) and it doesn't sound like your recording.

Defaults, also freshly downloaded.

The only thing I have done with the emulated sounds is to drop the treble to better match the output from the hardware.

Doesn't that partially defeat the purpose of the comparison?

How so? The real hardware was recorded via a TV which naturally produces a less clean sound than the emulators. Because I don't have a direct pipeline into my Duo's sound chip, adjusting the treble to match the conditions of the real hardware recording makes the comparison more valid than less.

[Bonknuts]

I wouldn't say that. Just because you altered all the records, doesn't make them or it any more valid. The idea was fun, but I was under the impression you weren't messing with/altering anything.

[sunteam_paul]

I could just have easily turned up the treble on my TV when I recorded the real hardware and ended up with a different recording. I had to create a comparison where the bass and treble in all recordings were as equal as possible. This isn't what I would call messing around with it - if it was then I can make real hardware sound nothing like real hardware by fiddling with the equaliser on my amp. It's missing the point really.

[spenoza]

Why did you have to record the Duo's audio via the TV? Can't you just use a simple adapter to run the audio line into your computer? Then you wouldn't have to do any adjustment of any kind.

[sunteam_paul]

Why did you have to record the Duo's audio via the TV? Can't you just use a simple adapter to run the audio line into your computer? Then you wouldn't have to do any adjustment of any kind.

I couldn't find the right leads. The emus would still have the advantage in clarity though, unless you ran them out the PC and back in via a cable...but I think that's going to far for what is essentially a simple test of the sound emulation itself, rather than the quality of the audio signal (which still wouldn't be an absolutely fair test). Besides, my PCE sounds like what comes out of my TV, so that's accurate to what I hear from real hardware when I'm playing.

[esteban]

OK, I finally listened to this, several times, and the differences between 1, 2 and 4 are rather subtle. #3 was the only obvious standout (weakest).

I actually am quite interested in this topic (sound emulation), so I would love it if you made more comparisons, Paul

Here's an an old thread about PCE vs. EMU sound, and I wish the sound files weren't broken links because the comparison was quite distinct.

Carry on...