Author Topic: REPAIR GUIDE - TurboDuo: Sound Fix  (Read 23772 times)

Duo_R

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Re: TURBO DUO SOUND FIX!! (56k beware)
« Reply #120 on: September 18, 2008, 04:04:39 PM »
BREAKING NEWS EVERYONE: THE LARGE CAPS CAN GO BAD!!!

Take a look at what I found today (note - you can see the leaking marks on these little bastards):


This was the 1000uf 16v, and the 470uf 16v (the one that was next to the 1000uf). The 470uf was fine the other side of the heatshields, but I replaced anyways. These caps are so close to the heat sinks I should have suspected. Instead some said they weren't usually a problem so I didn't bother. Now the replacements - the original caps are rated up to 85 degrees Celsius, but everything I am replacing with is up to 105 degrees Celsius (that's 221 Fahrenheit , so my Duo would be melting before these suckers break down).

Update on sound issue - the scratch sound is very minimized, and doesn't happen very much now. Maybe like a little sound every few minutes. I am going to check a few more caps. The only caps I haven't replaced in the sound (pre and post amp) area is two 330 caps. I am also going to check the 470uf cap near the power switch (although it might not be related to sound). Everything is a suspect at this point....

Oldschool - after replacing a sound cap I too noticed no sound (it is usually for like a minute or two) then the sound comes on. If it only happens once and then it is fine, it was just the cap charging (they are empty). Now if it still fades in and out, then you still have a bad sound cap somewhere.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2008, 04:09:51 PM by Duo_R »
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oldschoolgamer1989

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Re: TURBO DUO SOUND FIX!! (56k beware)
« Reply #121 on: September 18, 2008, 04:59:03 PM »
Thanks again! I'll run it again and see what happens. If it still fails, which ones do i need to replace and with what value? I'll need the uf and v ratings for each so i'll know what to pick up.

Duo_R

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Re: TURBO DUO SOUND FIX!! (56k beware)
« Reply #122 on: September 18, 2008, 05:11:19 PM »
the bigger caps are marked with V, the smaller ones just use between 16-35v

« Last Edit: September 18, 2008, 05:13:43 PM by Duo_R »
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oldschoolgamer1989

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Re: TURBO DUO SOUND FIX!! (56k beware)
« Reply #123 on: September 18, 2008, 05:21:17 PM »
Is there a way u could point out the exact ones i should start with. Probably all the 10 uf 16 v right? and use 10 uf 16v-35v on all but which ones?

Duo_R

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Re: TURBO DUO SOUND FIX!! (56k beware)
« Reply #124 on: September 18, 2008, 07:16:09 PM »
my suggestion is to replace almost everything in this picture:





check the other diagram for the values of everything. All the radial style caps, including the 1000uf, the 330uf, the 470uf, etc. And the smaller SMD that are near the heatsinks. The two caps that are on the other side of the heatsinks were fine on my Duo, but I would still be suspicious because of how close they are to the heatsinks.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2008, 07:18:01 PM by Duo_R »
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markeggertsen

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Re: TURBO DUO SOUND FIX!! (56k beware)
« Reply #125 on: September 18, 2008, 08:06:34 PM »
Hey D-Lite --

Are you taking orders for Duo fixes? My Duo has virtually NO sound, but if you turn the volume on your TV all the way up, you can hear all the sound VERY faintly. It was working fine just a week ago!

Thanks!

markeggertsen@gmail.com

Duo_R

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Re: TURBO DUO SOUND FIX!! (56k beware)
« Reply #126 on: September 18, 2008, 08:14:46 PM »
uhhh....dlite hasn't been on the boards for months. Long story.
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oldschoolgamer1989

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Re: TURBO DUO SOUND FIX!! (56k beware)
« Reply #127 on: September 19, 2008, 06:39:53 PM »
Thank you Duo_R!! You are the man! Changed all the ones you mentioned and the sound is back in full soon as it comes on. Everythings normal now. Also, special thanks to D-Lite for starting this post and leading us in the right direction. Without you guys, i don't think i would have ever figured this out. :dance:

somery

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Re: TURBO DUO SOUND FIX!! (56k beware)
« Reply #128 on: October 31, 2008, 12:31:19 PM »
Hi everyone. I signed up for the pcenginefx.com boards just to make this post. I wanted to thank everyone (especially d-lite, Duo-R and nat) for their hard work and many hours spent fiddling around inside their Turbo Duos. Because of their efforts, and this thread specifically, I've managed to fix the audio in my Turbo Duo all by my lonesome!

Now, I've played around with circuit-bending cheap Casio keyboards before, but that's all the experience with soldering I've ever had before now - and it was pretty shitty quality. (If I fried one, no big whoop. It was only a dollar at the thrift store!) However, when the sound in my Duo went out, I decided to get a little more serious because I was going to do this myself, dammit! I've never opened up a console before, let alone ripped out capacitors and soldered new ones in, so it was a little daunting at first. Nevertheless, I ordered the 4.5mm gamebit, hit up the local Radio Shack, rolled up my sleeves and got to work.

In the interest of science (heh) and to add, however insignificantly, to the general base of knowledge, here's how the whole thing went down. I should mention the circumstances. My Duo is a September 1992 model that I got off eBay (no, not from GameSquadStore!  =;) a few months ago. It played beautifully up until last week when the sound went scratchy (ADPCM and CD audio) and eventually went out altogether.

I also feel I should mention, maybe just for myself, that I got the TG-CD for Christmas the year it first came out. Yeah, the one that was 400 freakin' dollars and came with a CD+G disc with Jimi Hendrix's "Purple Haze" and Little Feat's "Representing the Mambo" and maybe some other songs. (Incidentally, I never hear this CD+G disc mentioned on the interwebs.) God bless my mom for that. Anyway, I still have the TG16 itself (with stickers all over it), but have long since lost all the CD hardware.

ANYWAY......

Day 1: The gamebit finally came in (actually it only took three days to get here), so I went to Radio Shack and bought two 10uF capacitors, hoping that replacing the two "post op-amp" caps would do the trick. Performed the very first desoldering job of my life, put in the new caps, put the system back together and tried it. Nothing. I should note that neither of these caps had leaked. Cried myself to sleep. (Not really.)

Day 2a: Decided to go ahead and replace the three "pre amp" caps. Bought two 10uF and two 22uF caps (just to have an extra). Cracked her open again and replaced the three caps. This time, the original 22uF cap did have leaky electrolytic goop under it. I cleaned it up with some isopropyl alcohol before soldering the new one on. Put her back together and tried it. Now I had ADPCM sound, but no CD audio. At least now I knew I was doing something right.

Day 2b: Came back again to this very thread to see where to go now. Came upon Duo-R's post about the other 22uF cap that Raven had mentioned and decided to have a go at it since I had a spare 22uF cap. Lo and behold, it had leaked as well. Cleaned it up, replaced it, and crossed my fingers that it would do the trick. I really don't have enough confidence in my skills (or time) to perform a complete cap replacement, so it had to do the trick! It just had to, dammit! Well, the Turbo Gods smiled down upon me that night (last night, actually) because this time all of the sound worked. Crystal clear and kick ass! Of course, Lords of Thunder was the tester CD.  :dance:

So I just wanted to say thanks, guys. I've tried a bunch of other games on it since last night and it's still doing great. Thanks to this thread and the people in it, another Duo was saved from the scrap heap and I got a little console repair experience under my belt. Good show, everyone!  :clap:
« Last Edit: October 31, 2008, 02:43:02 PM by somery »

Duo_R

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Re: TURBO DUO SOUND FIX!! (56k beware)
« Reply #129 on: October 31, 2008, 12:46:34 PM »
Another Duo saved. If I could do it all over I would have done a cap removal, dishwashed the PCB, dry for 2 days, and then do cap replacement. Congrats!!!  :clap:
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MarsPants

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Re: TURBO DUO SOUND FIX!! (56k beware)
« Reply #130 on: October 31, 2008, 02:16:25 PM »
Hey! This is an awesome thread. I've wanted to fix my Turbo Duo for awhile now but I still can't seem to get some things in order. I've gotten most of the equipment but I'm still confused about the capacitors because I don't know much about them and I don't want to break anything. In Canada we don't have RadioShack anymore so it's a pain to find anything. Any info on what to get and how to get it would be awesome.

Also I would love to see someone who really knows this stuff to maybe put together a little step by step guide? This thread is such a great mine for information but it would be great to see it focused and cleaned into something easier to follow. Things like dis assembly, advice on what capacitors to start, and tips on the capacitor soldering. It's all here but I'm absolutely terrible at filling in blanks. I'm always so paranoid about doing something wrong, I'm sure plenty of people could relate. Maybe asking too much, but just an idea.

Anyway, any help would be very appreciated! I'm dieing to play with sound again.

Duo_R

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Re: TURBO DUO SOUND FIX!! (56k beware)
« Reply #131 on: October 31, 2008, 06:16:04 PM »
Mars - I would do a guide but it is really straightforward. There is already a laser repair guide and that covers removing the case, etc.


http://www.robotpanic.com/?p=59


You will want to remove the metal sheild, desolder iron comes in handy. You will disconnect a wire from the power board, and the couple connectores near the laser and the screw that holds the ground wire. Remove about 4 screws holding the PCB, and then you can remove and work with just the board. This came in handy for me since I desoldered underneath the PCB to remove the caps. For surface mount caps I used a "lift technique" where I heated up one end of the SM cap and used a jewelers flathead to carefully lift up the cap. Then did the same on the other side. You remove the caps, and replace. Maybe a full guide later but if you read through this thread you will have all the information you need. I could understand more if this thing was 20 pages, but really it won't take you long to get what you need.
« Last Edit: October 31, 2008, 06:19:15 PM by Duo_R »
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MarsPants

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Re: TURBO DUO SOUND FIX!! (56k beware)
« Reply #132 on: November 01, 2008, 02:29:43 AM »
Thanks for the quick reply! These pictures are great, it gives me a little more idea what I'm doing. The info is good too, I'll have to practice some more before I try to pull it off though. Thanks!

Duo_R

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Re: TURBO DUO SOUND FIX!! (56k beware)
« Reply #133 on: November 01, 2008, 09:21:37 AM »
find some old electronics that you can practice removing caps, and then replacing. You will want to get this down since you get 1 shot with your system. You want to be careful not to lift off the solder pad from the board (can happen if you try to just break a cap off, etc). I replaced about 50 caps on my Duo and it turned out to be just fine. I believe it really is only the pre/post amp caps you need to replace, but in my situation I had a scratch sound that wouldn't go away. Not knowing what was causing the intermittent sound issue I just get replacing caps. Nat eventually advised of a dishwash which took care of my scratch sound (and if you read the posts in this forum you will follow my progress). Now sound works, and absolutely no scratch sound (cutting in and out). I am certain that I had some cap residue screwing with my sound and that is now fixed.
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agt_dale_cooper

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Re: TURBO DUO SOUND FIX!! (56k beware)
« Reply #134 on: November 07, 2008, 10:32:50 AM »
That's curious about the 1000uf cap needing to be replaced. That type of cap isn't prone to leakage or failure.... Are you sure it was necessary in your case, or were you just covering all your bases?

Speaking of the sound issues, I recently discovered a cap elsewhere on the mainboard outside of the op-amp cluster is directly linked to certain sound issues. Specifically, if you are having problems with all of the following: ADPCM sample playback, PSG, and redbook. The cap in question wasn't previously known to be part of the audio circuit at all and I have a feeling is the culprit in the cases where replacing all that caps in that circled area and to the right of the circled area don't fix the problem.

You have to remove the FCC shielding to even see this cap. It's kind of in the middle of the board, out in no man's land by itself. Like the component I discovered to be responsible for video failure on the TurboExpress, this is another innocuous little guy you'd never suspect. I'll post a picture up in the next couple of days that shows where to find the little rascal.

Hello, Diane, agt_dale_cooper here, still waiting to hear the outcome of this post quoted above....meanwhile, enjoying some damn fine coffee here in Twin Peaks.  Waiting for caps to show up from Parts Express, mentioned by PC_ENGINE HELL in reply #40.  SUPER cheap caps, more than reasonable USPS shipping as well.  Bought a Japanese Turbo Duo from George on the Turbo List, NO audio output whatsoever.  Popped the top, C301 (1000uF, 16V) was obviously damaged/leaking, but no other apparent damage.  To date, have replaced C301 (1000uF, 16V, rated to 105'C., Fry's P/N 1005343, NTE VHT1000M16, $1.90) and C616 (22uF, 16V, rated to 105'C., Fry's P/N 1005493, NTE VHT22M16, $0.88), but have no audio-related love from the machine yet.  Have not bothered with pre/post op caps yet, decided to wait for Parts Express rather than pay Radio Shit $1.20/piece.  Will continue posting methodology and part numbers used, will also comment them on the Parts Express site.  Expense report forthcoming, Diane, not to worry!  Looking forward to Agt. Nat's posting...thanks!  [how come there's no coffee-drinking smiley?]